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boy both of them loads are pretty fast...i could get the 9 pellets of 000 in my loads but the crimp did not look rite so i leave it at 8... john was there any pressure given for your books load...also would be interested in the loading data for these 2 loads of yours..old pete has made me a collector of factory loaded 10 ga recipes...pete lester has made it easy for us 10 ga shooters and reloaders... thanks john for the info.... charlie