Grouse Hunting TV

[mobirdhunter]

Originally Posted by Bruce Hering

I have heard of close working dogs referred to as "foot dogs", singles dogs" and close working dogs. This does seem to have an attachment to differentiate between close dogs and horseback shooting dogs although todays "shooting dog" classes look more like the All Age classes of 25 years or so ago.

JMHO

This thread just popped up again for me, and I read it with a smile. As Bruce points out, in the South and Mid-West (at least in Southern Illinois, Missouri, Oklahoma and Kansas) you will see field trails often advertised and talked about as "foot trials" to distinguish them from horseback trials. Two distinctly different trials in terms of what is sought after by the participants. Range and speed, along with "style on point" (read as: high head and tail) were the winning combination among the horseback set, while the foot trialers wanted dogs that worked to the front and that pointed (with style), but were within a comfortable range for a person on foot. Except for the Shoot-to-Retrieve crowd, many foot trialers really wanted their dogs to range and run like horseback, All Age dogs.
It often seemed to me that they were horseback trial "wannabes."

There was also a term that was used for a dog that found lots of birds, but did not run out of sight or point with the rigid high tail. Those were called "meat dogs." It was frequently used in reference to any non-English Pointer/Setter. In the trial circles, those dogs were held is disdain, but on the side, guys would ask if they could hunt with their owners.

The eye of the beholder is sometimes fickle, but a dog that loves his business and produces birds for his master is a jewell, and if his looks meet his master's aesthetic sensibility, he's a winner in my book.

[Bruce Hering]

Originally Posted by Garry L Gordon

This thread just popped up again for me, and I read it with a smile. As Bruce points out, in the South and Mid-West (at least in Southern Illinois, Missouri, Oklahoma and Kansas) you will see field trails often advertised and talked about as "foot trials" to distinguish them from horseback trials. Two distinctly different trials in terms of what is sought after by the participants. Range and speed, along with "style on point" (read as: high head and tail) were the winning combination among the horseback set, while the foot trialers wanted dogs that worked to the front and that pointed (with style), but were within a comfortable range for a person on foot. Except for the Shoot-to-Retrieve crowd, many foot trialers really wanted their dogs to range and run like horseback, All Age dogs.
It often seemed to me that they were horseback trial "wannabes."

There was also a term that was used for a dog that found lots of birds, but did not run out of sight or point with the rigid high tail. Those were called "meat dogs." It was frequently used in reference to any non-English Pointer/Setter. In the trial circles, those dogs were held is disdain, but on the side, guys would ask if they could hunt with their owners.

The eye of the beholder is sometimes fickle, but a dog that loves his business and produces birds for his master is a jewell, and if his looks meet his master's aesthetic sensibility, he's a winner in my book.

I just reread this thread and thought I would add some info etc.

I grew up in the very NE corner of NJ. Woodcock and grouse were still present there. Woodcock in great numbers when the flights were in. Remember this was the 50's so there was not near the development we see today.

My Dad broke his early year pups on the spring return woodcock flight. The nursery property we lived on was a hot spot for those birds flying back north. He always wanted his dogs snappy, meaning moving through the cover with some speed but using their noses to guide them to the point, nose in the air, not down. He also wanted a stylish dog pointing with high tail and erect head. Not something crawling into a point although that could happen as most of you know.

As I aged and went off to school (1960's) I ended up working for Herb Holmes at Gunsmoke Kennels when he was in Illinois. That started a long relationship for Dad with the Gunsmoke line as well as the Elhew line through Bob Wehle.

I was after the setters and looked to several grouse trial lines as well as the Smith line of setters. I wanted as did my Dad a gun dog that hunted to the gun, not one that needed to be hunted for.

That is the point of this discussion. A dog that goes about its business in an animated way within the desired distance from the gun. Thats a "foot dog, gun dog, meat dog" although style and deportment may be a bit different for each owner.

Over the years that we hunted and trialed our dogs many were able to discern the difference between the handler being mounted and a foot. What a pleasure to have such an animal... I like others here, I am sure, would love to dial the clock back to enjoy those days once more.

[mobirdhunter]

Originally Posted by Bruce Hering

I like others her, I am sure, would love to dial the clock back to enjoy those days once more.

Amen to that.