A&F CHE 20ga

[Bill Murphy]

Bruce, I will answer your question about Parker recommended loads for large frame 20 gauges. My old #2 frame VH 20, #153,333 was ordered by Orren R. Dickey in Boston in the era of the smallbore booklets. The order requested that the gun be built to shoot 1 ounce of shot. The smallbore pamphlet of the time stated that such a load "Is not loaded by the ammunition companies and not recommended by Parker Brothers". Recommended or not, they would build you a gun to shoot it. By the way, I'm looking for my old 20 to add to my collection.

[AmarilloMike]

Hi Bruce:

I am in love with that gun. Damascus barreled 20ga C grade in bird gun configuration, original A&F case - oh yeah! Twere it mine I might sell all my other guns and use the money to take it hunting year round. I would go to the Southern hemisphere when it is Summer in the North.

Gough Thomas / GT Garwood writes extensively of patten density, shot size, and game. As do Bob Brister and Charles Askins (the elder). Or course, since Burrard covered everything, he covered that subject too.


Best,


Mike

[C.O.B.]

For the life of me I can't see why anyone would want to use 1oz of shot in a 20ga. If that shot charge is needed/wanted the shooter would be better suited to using a 16 or a 12.

Nice gun Bruce that roundaval engraveing isn't seen on many guns. I wonder why they didn't do more of that style of engraveing IMHO it's pretty classy.

[JAMES HALL]

Originally Posted by Brian Dudley

That C is another one we can call "Big Bird".

Its only 29 serial numbers difference. Jim

[Bruce Day]

Rich, I'm a believer in matching shot weight to bore. 3/4 to 7/8 for 20, 7/8 to 1 for 16 and 1 to 1/8 for 12. Parker Bros and the old shotgunners knew things that the ammunition and gun industry seems to have forgotten today.

Mike, thanks and you have some fabulous guns, such as that 20ga A. I'm looking for the definition of killing circle. We all have the sense of what it is but there must have been a definition published somewhere circa 1910.

[Bill Murphy]

Don't be so wrapped up in the "bird gun" mentality. Variety is what makes the Parker world go around. Without .410s, 28s, 10s, and 8s, Parkers would be as boring as some other brands. No, I didn't shoot any heavy loads in my old 3" 20 gauge, but it was a neat Parker nonetheless.

[Craig Larter]

I really like rondel engraving very different and interesting in my opinion. Every time Bruce posts pictures of his C I get all weak in the knees!! A dealer in Duluth has a straight grip BH with rondel engraving that makes me sweat every time I look at the pictures.

[charlie cleveland]

really nice guns shown and talked about...but on the shot charges i guess i m a oddball i like the heavier charges in my loads..1 ounce to 1 1/4 in a 20 ga 1 to 11/4 in 16 ga 1 1/8 to 2 1/4 ounce in the12 ga same load for the mighty ten and up to 3 ounce for the 8 ga. these are hunting loads i prefer...and just my opinion...charlie

[Snap Cap]

Bruce, I have attempted to enter some information on the meaning of killing circles circa 1910 for three nights in a row and have been frustrated by the timing out of this web site's sign in feature, i.e. after typing in a couple of paragraphs and hitting the reply button, i am directed to sign in again and after doing such, I am directed to back key to enter a reply, and proceed to lose all the reply's contents. Therefore, I now surrender and instead of giving a detailed answer siting sources, I will just leave this terse answer:

Bruce, this term does make for some interesting reading in the shooting literature. In The Gun and Its Development 1910 edition Greener says: " The term "Killing Circles" is used to designate the extent of the spread of the pellets in a lateral direction, so long as the "pattern" is not too wide to allow of the escape of the game." Pages 369-385 go on to illustrate several different 30 inch patterns and give the killing circle size for each. The size bird illustrated is a Pigeon. HTH.

[Snap Cap]

Bruce, as I said previously, I will not be siting other sources, but I would be willing to cite a few.