VH 410 info needed

[Frank T. Pomes]

Hello,
I'm a new member and wanted to introduce myself and ask a question.

I recently picked up a VH 410. I've been looking at pictures online and can find others like it with one difference. Mine has a single trigger and a safety/selector on the tang. According to the serial# it was made in 1928. I miked the bores and there appears to be a slight difference but I really can't get a good reading. It reads .387 left and .397 right.

Everything I find has double triggers and no selector. Any info would be great.

Thank you
Frank

[Eric Eis]

Sounds like you have a 410 with a Miller trigger installed on it.

[John Dunkle]

Hi Frank!

Welcome! As well - I think Eric is right on... The Parker single trigger wasn't selected from safety (as were Miller triggers).

On a 410 - a Parker trigger would be more like:

http://parkerguns.org/forums/picture.php?albumid=5&pictureid=11

Best to you - and welcome again!

John

[Frank T. Pomes]

Really! I never expected that. The trigger looks like the photo you posted, but the safety is marked SAFE in the standard lettering but then marked R,S,L from top to bottom. I thought it unusual that it was stamped and engraved. So was a Miller trigger something that was done at that time? Is it desireable? Was it done at the factory or is it like a Timney is today? It is a rifle like crisp trigger and as a shooter I like the selector.

Frank

[John Dunkle]

Hi Frank,

Yes - as you can see in the photo, the selector on that .410 in the photo is to the left of the trigger. The Miller selector on another Parker I have reference to, is on the safety selector as you describe ("R - S - L" on the safety). Millers are period correct for your .410

Hope this helps - and again - welcome to the PGCA Forum!

John

[Frank T. Pomes]

Thanks again. I guess I didn't know what to look for in your photo. Can I safely shoot modern 2 1/2" loads in this? It is the Vulcan Steel Barrel.

Frank

[E Robert Fabian]

Millers are period correct as John stated, but you are correct they are like a Timney on a rifle and yes Frank they are desirable becouse of there dependabilty.

[Rich Anderson]

Frank you have one of the early Miller triggers. I have one just like yours on a DHE 20 mfg in 1927. The trigger works in two ways, push it forward in the normal mannner and the right bbl is fired first, push it back and the left bbl fires first hence the RSL mrkings. The middell position is safe.

I have had my gun about 6years and have had no problems. I have other Parkers with a Miller trigger as well and all function flawlessly.

You have my "Holy Grail" of Parkers the 410 congrats:bowdown:

[Frank T. Pomes]

Thank You.

It is shootable right?

[Jack Cronkhite]

Frank: Frankly I'm surprised no one has yet offered this service, so let me be the first. I will field test your gun throughout the month of October 2010. If there remains some doubt, I will continue the test throughout November and December. I will return the gun with an opinion on its shootability no later than January 2011. I will save some pheasant meat for you, should it have proven shootable.
Cheers,
Jack

On a more serious note, provided the action is tight, the barrels on face with no deep pitting, dents or bulges, it is quite likely shootable. An examination by a competent gunsmith should be undertaken if you have concerns. Shootability cannot be determined through forum discussion.

[Dean Romig]

Ahem, Mr. Dunkle.... I had asked you some months ago to return my VHE .410 skeet gun post haste but instead, you have chosen to post pictures of it as if it were your own. Can you explain your actions?

I had tried to send you a PM but the administrator is apparantly against my contacting you privately....

[Dave Suponski]

I dunno Dean....John seem's to do that alot...Good Luck

[Bill Murphy]

Your gun is probably bored modified and full if your measurements are correct. It would have been factory bored for 2 1/2" shells but may have been bored out for 3" shells when they were made available in the early thirties. The Miller trigger would not have been installed at the Parker factory. Service on Miller triggers is available from Dan May and Ken Waite. Contact information is available from members here.

[Frank T. Pomes]

Thank you all for the info.
Mr Cronkhite,
Being new to this site I had no idea that the field testing service you mentioned was available. I will be boxing up this little SxS and shipping it to you at my earliest convience. Please feel free to keep it as long as you deem necessary in order to properly evaluate it.
The Pheasant you promised would be wonderful but if you could possibly send some Ptarmigan it would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you in advance,

Frank

[Richard Flanders]

This has gotten confusing. It seems that his single trigger is selectable with the tang safety and not next to the trigger as with a Miller. Is that correct Frank? Or do you have the selector like John shows in the picture above, right next to the trigger on the floorplate and barely visible in the picture unless you know what to look for?

[Frank T. Pomes]

I don't know how to post pics but I ought to be able to put up links to them.
Lookat that I guess I can post pics.

[Richard Flanders]

Hmmm, as I thought. Ok guys, now what kind of a trigger is that one?? Doesn't look like a Miller to me....

[Jack Cronkhite]

Frank: It is a service happily provided. Ptarmigan it will be then. Mr. Flanders may now want to assist, as those birds are in his back yard while mine are a day's drive north for the willow ptarmigan and a day's drive west for the rock ptarmigan. I will still include some pheasant for you and if you like, add in some rough grouse, sharptail grouse and hungarian partridge. Shootability may require further examination in other jurisdictions due to the subtleties of local environmental factors. A tour through the hands of those on this forum should ensure all eventualities are covered, giving you a thorough evaluation, upon which you surely could rely.
Cheers,
Jack
http://www.shotgunworld.com/bbs/cpg1410/albums/userpics/normal_HPIM7471SGW.JPG

[Dave Suponski]

Rich,Sure looks to be a Miller to me. The trigger on John's gun looks to be a Parker two screw single trigger.

Frank,Is "Miller" stamped on the left side of the trigger?

[Richard Flanders]

I thought the Millers were what John showed and like the Repros have. I guess I've never seen a Miller if that's what they look like. Thanks Dave...

And Jack; I would be glad to participate in the testing of that little sweety on Ptarmigan. Just send it to me after you're done with it on pheasants and I'll spend next April testing it. I just happen to have very recently acquired two boxes of older Mark V 2.5" .410 shells....

Here's a baby ptarmigan I caught on the tundra here on June 28. He seemed unable to fly away with his mama and siblings. Hope he's ok. Cute little bugger, eh?

[Bill Murphy]

The picture Frank just posted is of the early variation of the Miller trigger. The less common late Miller trigger has a rocker ahead of the trigger for a selector. Neither are similar to the original Parker trigger selector. Nice gun, Frank. Do you mind sharing how you found such a treasure?

[Dave Suponski]

Rich,The Parker Repro single trigger is designed like a Parker two screw trigger.

And ya.. very cute little guy....:)

[Dave Suponski]

Bill,Are the early and late Miller's just as dependable?

[Bill Murphy]

I've never owned a late design Miller, but all of my early Millers are working and have never failed. The one on my PHE Trap has probably been fired a million times judging from the condition of the gun.

[Dave Suponski]

Thanks Bill, I have a DHE double trap with the early Miller. I crisper trigger I have never owned. Wonderful...

[Dean Romig]

Mr Pomes,

If you haven't already experienced problems with the safety and/or single trigger function, you may soon. It appears the rear screw on the top tang is protruding excessively up through the tang and the closer the top and bottom tangs get to each other the more prone it will be to malfunction.

....wouldn't you agree Mr. Suponski? :duck:

[Frank T. Pomes]

Hey Bill,
After everyones help I didn't want to be rude. I ended up with the gun pretty much by chance. A friend of a friend deal. A guy I work with had a friend out of work and selling whatever he could. I wasn't really interested in most of his SHTF stuff but he mentioned an old SxS shotgun. He said it was a 410. I told him I really had no use since I'm primarily a waterfowler but to bring it by.
He brought it, told me what the guy was looking for, and I took it.
I'm pretty sure its just a shooter. I don't think its got a lot of collector value.

Frank

[Dean Romig]

Any Parker .410 has collector value.