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David Figg
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Posted: Tue Apr 14th, 2009 02:43 am |
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| I received this catalog from the estate of my uncle. He got the catalog from my grandfather after he passed away. My grandfather got the catalog when he was younger and before he had 9 kids...so I beleive this to be an original, not a copy. Now to the unknown part. The catalog is not dated, but there is a statement in the book on the "Our Aim" page that states: "From the beginning of our career of nearly fifty years...", indicating that it was printed in the early 10-15 years of the 20th century. Does anyone know of this particular book? It's in fair to good condition with the original string binding. I hope the attached picture will help in it's identification. Attached Image (viewed 338 times):
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Harry Sanders
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Posted: Tue Apr 14th, 2009 11:43 am |
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| Looks like the first page inside the cover on a number of different catalogs. If you have the Parker Story narrow you search based on the size and then zero in.
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Bruce Day
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Posted: Tue Apr 14th, 2009 12:10 pm |
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David, you asked me this two days ago and I sent you these photos.
This is the Muderlak Old Reliable Publishing reproduction.
Cover:
Attached Image (viewed 285 times):
 Last edited on Tue Apr 14th, 2009 12:55 pm by Bruce Day
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Bruce Day
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Bruce Day
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Posted: Tue Apr 14th, 2009 12:48 pm |
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Inside:
See page 22 inside for the "fifty years" quotation you cited.
Attached Image (viewed 284 times):
 Last edited on Tue Apr 14th, 2009 01:00 pm by Bruce Day
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Bruce Day
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Jeff Kuss
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Posted: Tue Apr 14th, 2009 01:02 pm |
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It appears to be the first page of one of the pine cone catalogs.
Jeff
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Bruce Day
PGCA Member
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Posted: Tue Apr 14th, 2009 01:10 pm |
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Hello Jeff. The first page is the same between the Pine Cones and Flying Geese catalogs, at least on mine. The fifty years quotation is on page 22 of Flying Geese and on p. 19 of my Pine Cones, it says forty years, so I figured it was the Flying Geese and told him that on Sunday. Whatever, Mr Figg has a catalog missing the covers. He was trying to "get a value" and may have wanted a second opinion. When its missing the covers I don't know the precise value. I think he is more interested in the latter than trying to determine which catalog as a Parker paper collector.
I know the Pine Cones and the Flying Geese covers were printed at various times. What I don't know is whether every time Parker reissued the cover they changed the inside statement about how many years Parker had been in business. My Flying Geese is a 1913 issue with the fifty years statement.
Both the Flying Geese and Pine Cones catalogs have excellent reproductions, so its not like the Balancing Clown brochure, which only exists in a handful of known originals.
Now, I'm no Parker expert and certainly not an expert on Parker paper, and I know there are those that are, so if I'm off base, let me know.
Last edited on Tue Apr 14th, 2009 01:42 pm by Bruce Day
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Bill Murphy
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Posted: Tue Apr 14th, 2009 02:37 pm |
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| If you were to correctly describe your catalog on ebay.com as a 1915 Flying Geese (uh oh, "ducks") catalog, missing the covers and describing the inside condition, you would be surprised how much you would get for it. Many of us have catalogs with various amounts of damage that we would like to improve on. It doesn't matter a bit whether a catalog has been reproduced, some of us want originals and will pay for them. The Flying Ducks is a scarce catalog with wonderful content. sc.com is trying to get $675.00 for one. Of course, he's had it a long time. He also has one for $575.00 that he also describes as being in excellent condition with inserts. I guess the Parker paper market has tanked along with everything else. Last edited on Tue Apr 14th, 2009 04:23 pm by Bill Murphy
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Bruce Day
PGCA Member
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Posted: Tue Apr 14th, 2009 04:04 pm |
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| Bill, looks like you are a Parker paper collector. Do you have one of the Clown catalogs? Last edited on Tue Apr 14th, 2009 04:13 pm by Bruce Day
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Bill Murphy
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Posted: Tue Apr 14th, 2009 04:21 pm |
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| The last guy that got into a discussion about Clown Catalogs on this forum was banned, apparently for life. Of course, the discussion that got him banned involved the PGCA Clown Catalog. Oh, gosh, I forgot. PGCA has a Clown Catalog if you are interested in reading one. As far as whether I own one or not, you'll have to talk to The Lovely Linda. We'll both be at the Southern in a week or so.
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Bruce Day
PGCA Member
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Posted: Tue Apr 14th, 2009 04:45 pm |
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Bill, I don't know anything about that and I have been in and active, at least out here far removed from Parker centers, since 1994. The Clown catalog is rare and pretty neat and I thought you might have one that you could share photos of, that's all.
I had never seen the 1937 Good Hands catalog untill Eric Eis kindly let me leaf carefully through his. I was later able to find a nice one for myself through a PGCA member. And I was able to pick up a lot of reproductions from Ed Muderlak and a reproduction of the Small Bore Shot Guns from you, so I'm happy. Sure, I'd like to find a Clown catalog if the price was right.
A person learns a lot about Parker shotguns by just reading what Parker said in their catalogs and I always have a lot to learn about them.
Last edited on Tue Apr 14th, 2009 05:19 pm by Bruce Day
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Bill Murphy
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Posted: Tue Apr 14th, 2009 05:20 pm |
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| As far as photos of the Clown Catalog, it would be a piece of cake for the BOD at PGCA to photograph the PGCA Archives Clown Catalog and post it for our information and entertainment on this forum. I would suggest that PGCA reproduce it for sale, but I won't mention that because I like having posting privileges on this forum.
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Bruce Day
PGCA Member
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Posted: Tue Apr 14th, 2009 06:07 pm |
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Would that devalue the few ones in the hands of collectors?
I'd be happy to have just a blow up of the front cover for a wall mounted picture because its pretty. I've never seen the inside so I don't know if it contains any new information. If is just the standard stuff that is in other catalogs, I wouldn't want to do anything that would lessen value for the few that have stepped up and bought them. But maybe thats just me and I'll leave that to the experts. I don't own one and those that do call the shots. I can't figure if you have one or not but if you do, well I suppose you could do what you want .
Last edited on Tue Apr 14th, 2009 06:11 pm by Bruce Day
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Bill Murphy
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Posted: Tue Apr 14th, 2009 06:33 pm |
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| What I would "like" is for PGCA to reproduce their Clown for sale. I have never heard any Parker paper collector mention loss of value because of the reproduction of an item in his collection. I would like to see the Remington Salesman's Portfolio reproduced since it has never been seen by more than a handful of PGCA members. Unfortunately, it would be a costly venture. However, Larry Baer was able to reproduce the 1895 Showroom Catalog and market it at a price anyone could afford. Today it should be even cheaper to reproduce.
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Bill Murphy
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Posted: Tue Apr 14th, 2009 06:47 pm |
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| To have a complete collection of Clowns, you would need the variation with prices to $375.00, the variation with prices to $400.00, as well as the variation not mentioned in The Parker Story, the variation with prices to $500.00. By the way, the Clown cover is pictured in Volume 2 of The Parker Story.
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Dave Suponski
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Posted: Tue Apr 14th, 2009 07:01 pm |
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I have zerox copys of the "Clown " catalog pages but am not sure what variation they are.In fact I didn,t even know there was a variation till just now! This is great I learned something new today!
I need two of the repro catalogs to have them all.I have looked long and hard for these two as they are old reprints. Will have to look tonight to see which ones they are.
I use the list Ed posted here along time ago as a guide.
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Bruce Day
PGCA Member
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Posted: Tue Apr 14th, 2009 08:03 pm |
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I have the Larry Baer deluxe two volume set plus the repro of the 1895 NY saleroom catalog. The catalog is large, a wonderful piece that when I display my small collection, I set out the catalog open to the gun above.
I'm happy to have the few repro catalogs I have plus the 1937 original. Like Dave Suponski I buy them when I can and would like to get a complete collection at some point. I have the squirrel repro poster from Muderlak and was glad to get it. Dave, do you still have the repro list?
Bill, it was unknown to me that there are various versions of the Clown brochure. One would be well enough for me and I'll look with the historical prices in mind.
Bill, I see you were inquiring about the late Rem Parker salesman's portfolio. I've seen and gone through one and it had a lot to do with Remington and not so much to do with Parker. It was a lot like the 1937 Good Hands catalog in the illustrations. The portfolio assembly was the most interesting. While this reproduction paper is interesting to some, I think most people could care less. Ed Muderlak used to talk about the money he had tied up in high quality but slow moving reproductions and he finally got rid of them by sending extras out with his latest book. People will balk at spending $20 on a repro when it costs you near that much to make one. The Clown catalog, you could spend thousands making a high quality reproduction and sell 100 if you are lucky. After being involved with that Parker calendar a couple years ago and all the people who said they wanted one and the few who actually wanted to pay for one, I'll never advocate paper again.
Last edited on Tue Apr 14th, 2009 09:53 pm by Bruce Day
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Bill Murphy
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Posted: Tue Apr 14th, 2009 09:59 pm |
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| Bruce, I think the 1937 Remington Salesman's Portfolio had plenty to do with Parker. It contained photos or engravings of every grade of gun that Parker (or Remington) was making at the time with the exception of the high grade singles. There must be something in there if they sell for five grand or more. As far as "most people could care less", I think those who own nice collections of repro Parker paper actually care quite a bit. I think most collectors create their own interest level in paper after becoming well involved in the collecting of the guns. How many of us do you think are "well involved in the collection of the guns"? Probably the membership of PGCA divided by two or three. That is not a big number. No wonder Ed became frustrated in the marketing of his reproductions. By the way, this marketing of repro paper isn't just about the money. I have a great file of letters from people who ordered my repro Parker paper, and also have an envelope full of uncashed checks. Whenever someone ordered more than one item, I never cashed the check because there was someone who was really interested in Parkers. It must have driven them crazy trying to balance their checkbooks because of the missing little checks. As a matter of fact, one PGCA member told me some time ago that he would like to have a Clown Catalog so he could reproduce it by the hundreds and give them away. I think his motives were a bit deeper than mere altruism. You're very perceptive in stating that you will never advocate paper again. Reproducing a Remington ad to market to a Parker collectors group may have had a fatal flaw that had nothing to do with the fact that it was "paper". Last edited on Tue Apr 14th, 2009 10:17 pm by Bill Murphy
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Bill Bolyard
PGCA Member
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Posted: Tue Apr 14th, 2009 10:17 pm |
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Bruce,
Lc Smith ran into the same problem with there Calender, no one wanted to pay. There is a way of reproducing posters that is affordable and cost effective. Have a high quality photo taken buy one of our members who shoots pictures profesionally and have it reproduced online by Kodak. I think the cost would be around $20 in one piece qty.
Bill
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Bruce Day
PGCA Member
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Posted: Tue Apr 14th, 2009 10:19 pm |
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Bill, I've been there in the hot seat and never again. I'm just staying out west to enjoy my small Parker collection, help the PGCA out here when asked, chase after the new puppy and go bird hunting.
My PGCA business card reads " Great Plains Coordinator" and that's all its going to say.
And I have Dunkle's pheasant hunting cowboy hat waiting for him.
Attached Image (viewed 155 times):
 Last edited on Tue Apr 14th, 2009 10:51 pm by Bruce Day
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Bill Bolyard
PGCA Member
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Posted: Tue Apr 14th, 2009 10:22 pm |
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Bruce,
Ill take it, I dont have any.
Bill
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