Research Letter validation

[Andy]

Originally Posted by Harold Lee Pickens

Good eye Andy

Just LOOKIN' out for ya' Harold

[ArtS]

I checked the serialization book and it doesn't appear there, so the only records would be the factory records.

I did a little research to update my memory, and was reminded that during this period Parker offered only 12, 14 and 16 gauge in the hammerless gun. The 10 gauge guns were all marked as N grade to justify the slightly higher price. Also, the hammer guns were technically P guns and the hammerless guns were PH guns during this period. However, The Parker Story states that many PH guns were marked only P. If the work book lists this gun as a P grade, the letter may show that it is a hammer gun, since there is no way to tell the difference.

As two the barrels, I am far from an expert, but the front of the muzzle shows no gaps, the barrels look to touch and the top rib has the proper engraved delineation line and the non-engraved band at the front past the bead. My opinion if asked would be that they are factory 26" barrels. No idea about the 10 ga barrel length record source, but the hammer part is pretty easily explained.

If I were buying this gun without seeing the letter, I would have no trouble believing it was a proper PH 12 gauge with factory 26" Plain Twist barrels. In the condition it is in, it should be desireable to someone wanting a nice entry level Parker.

The TPS records that there were slightly less than 200 of these guns in that grade and barrel length made. The actual numbers can make it slightly more. The total of that grade and configuration and all barrel lengths is over 1000. Personally my experience is that Parkers of most configurations with rare short barrel lengths are noteworthy but don't translate into a lot of added value. They do, however, increase interest and help sales. Long barrels are a different story.

[Scowl]

Thanks everyone for all the info. Turns out my email never made it to Chuck because I used .com instead of .org and just recently got an undeliverable message. He did reply to me though that the letter is correct except for it should be Quality PH hammerless. The handwriting was hard to read. That makes sense. So, I did get some 10ga shells and it is definitely NOT a 10ga gun. Since Chuck confirmed the research letter then the barrels had to have been modified, so my confusion is now cleared up. Thanks to everyone for the response.

[John Davis]

I've got to say that those barrels look pretty right to me. But then what do I know?

[ArtS]

I'll make one more comment and then drop it. I participated in this and somehow assumed that the serial numbers match on all the pieces. It suddenly dawned on me that this was not mentioned, the gun was never shown assembled and the forend iron and the barrel lug was never shown. This could simply be good barrels and they are on the wrong gun.

I am certain at this point that you have recieved the correct data shown in the records. However, this would likely not be the first Parker with an incorrect entry in the records if that should be true.

I think we all agree that the action/stock is original. The barrels I think can be assumed to be correct 12 gauge 1 frame and original (but maybe not to this gun). Look on the inside of the forearm at the metal piece and on the side of the barrel lug and see if the serial number of the barrels, the forend iron and wood and the gun all match. If they do, I think the gun is all original and the records in error. I don't think anyone would go to the effort of re-numbering replacement barrels for a P grade unless done by the factory. Also, as mentioned, if this were originally a 10 gauge for this period it almost certainly have been an N grade, not a P. (I actually have a matching 10 gauge from a few years later like this one, and that was still the practice then.)

Also it would be nice to see a closeup of the action/barrel assembly when put together. The barrels are 1 frame barrels. A 10 gauge would most commonly been a 3 frame but maybe a 2. If the barrel breeches and frame fit together correctly, the frame must be a 1 frame also.

Something doesn't add up for any of the scenarios if the records are actually correct and the gun original. The only viable answer I can see is that a light gun was requested and 1 frame P grade frame was used as a basis and 10 gauge barrels were fitted, then later replaced by someone with 1 frame 12 gauge barrels. Anything else points to an oddity.

Check that all the serial numbers match first. If so the records are totally wrong. If the forend and action match and the barrels are different, then the above scenario is suppported. I don't see a situation where the records were accurate unless the 10 ga gun was stamped with the wrong grade stamp.

Also post a picture of the assembled gun showing the barrel/sction fit. I think we can tell from that if smaller barrels have been fitted.

[John Davis]

Seems to me that all the mysteries have been cleared up except as to barrel length. So you are left with four possibilities:

1) The barrels have been cut.
2) The gun was returned and the barrels were replaced by Parker at a later date.
3) The barrels were replaced aftermarket by someone other than Parker.
4) The Order Book is wrong.

Options 2 and 4 are going to be extremely difficult to prove. Leaving Options 1 or 3 as your most likely scenarios.

[Bill Murphy]

The muzzle end of the rib shows that this is probably an original 26" gun. Chuck should be along soon to confirm that his letter contains the correct information or, possibly in error, Chuck's first one.

[ArtS]

I have no doubt Chuck's information is correct as shown. I do believe it is possible that the factory records were at times incorrectly entered, noted, crossed up or whatever. They were entered by hand in a running system by 19th century factory workers working at a hard pace. Things happen.

[charlie cleveland]

I believe the barrels are not cut look at the end of the barrels the matting stops before the end of the barrel and the little sqiggly line is across the end of the barrels....charlie

[Researcher]

Originally Posted by Ryan Brege

Looks like a 1 Frame? I don't think there were many 10's made on a 1 frame, that would be pretty rare.

Ryan

When I saw that 1, I was hoping this gun would double the number of known 1-frame 10-gauges.