Parker Gun Collectors Association Forums  

Go Back   Parker Gun Collectors Association Forums Non-Parker Specific & General Discussions Man's Best Friend

Notices

Reply
Thread Tools Display Modes
Retriever Field Trials
Unread 04-11-2022, 12:36 PM   #1
Member
Alfred Houde
PGCA Lifetime
Member

Member Info
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 825
Thanks: 193
Thanked 672 Times in 248 Posts

Default Retriever Field Trials

I have a question for those who participate in Retriever Trials. Specifically, AKC Master events.

I notice while watching as a spectator an excessive number of whistles and hand signals. I just don't see the need to whistle and stop a dog every 10 yards just to give him a hand signal in the direction he was going anyway.

Or am I missing the point that at that level it is all about taking direction and teamwork between dog and handler? Is this why so many owners use professional handlers?

I guess that may be why I prefer Hunt Tests over Trials. I like that a dog is judged on Natural Ability and a standard, rather than against other entries.

Curious on other takes on this.
Alfred Houde is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 04-11-2022, 12:49 PM   #2
Member
Twoatlow8
Forum Associate

Member Info
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 356
Thanks: 417
Thanked 403 Times in 97 Posts

Default

I have pointing dogs. I prefer AKC Hunt tests over Field trials, I think more of a Master Hunter than a “Field Champion”.
A “Field Champion” is useless to me in a hunting situation.
An AKC hunt test is a game for dogs.
A Field trial is a game of Men, basically look what I can pay someone to get my dog to do.
I will prepare for incoming.
__________________
“The price of a good gundog is a broken heart at the end.” ~ Rudyard Kipling
Scott Janowski is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 04-24-2022, 01:31 PM   #3
Member
Matt Mahoney
Forum Associate

Member Info
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Posts: 14
Thanks: 0
Thanked 3 Times in 2 Posts

Default

If it was a Master event, it was not a field trial, but a hunt test. The difference is that in a field trial there are winners(1st, 2nd, 3rd and JAM) and losers. In a hunt test, the distances are shorter, the tests are typically not as challenging and there are no "winners", just Pass or Fail.

The dogs are sent on blind retrieves using whistle stops and then hand/arm direction. The whistle and re-directs are used to keep them on line to the bird. The ideal is no whistles, but a direct line to the bird. So, the dogs that were getting lots of whistles were not doing as well as the dogs that weren't.
Matt Mahoney is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 04-24-2022, 08:51 PM   #4
Member
Big D
PGCA Member
 
John Dallas's Avatar

Member Info
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,284
Thanks: 461
Thanked 3,597 Times in 1,550 Posts

Default

In the U.S, because so many dogs are trained to the highest level, trial setups are designed to throw dogs out.

For hunters, if you look at Lab kennels advertising in the DU magazine, almost all are promoting British dogs. British trials are entirely different from American trials. The winning dogs in each nation would never place in trials in the other country
__________________
"Striving to become the man my dog thinks I am"
John Dallas is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 04-27-2022, 04:42 PM   #5
Member
Twoatlow8
Forum Associate

Member Info
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 356
Thanks: 417
Thanked 403 Times in 97 Posts

Default

I disagree that an AKC Hunt test is not as challenging as a field trial.
My experience is in AKC pointing dog hunt tests, so this is what I am referring to.
A master hunter is a completely finished dog that can hunt with anyone.
A master hunter will be absolutely steady to wing and shot, AND retrieve your bird to hand in good condition, with minimal commands. He will also honor another dog on point and not move until you release him.
I think the real game should be a timed event, let’s say 45 minutes.
You get only 5 shells, there are birds set for you. The winner is the one who comes back with the most birds.
__________________
“The price of a good gundog is a broken heart at the end.” ~ Rudyard Kipling
Scott Janowski is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 04-27-2022, 04:52 PM   #6
Member
Alfred Houde
PGCA Lifetime
Member

Member Info
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 825
Thanks: 193
Thanked 672 Times in 248 Posts

Default

But what about the dog and handler that needs to run 20-30 Master tests to get those six passes?

Is that really a Master Hunter?

Don't get me wrong I enjoy Hunt Tests. I think they are a valuable tool, training aid, and judge of natural ability.
Alfred Houde is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 04-27-2022, 07:03 PM   #7
Member
Matt Mahoney
Forum Associate

Member Info
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Posts: 14
Thanks: 0
Thanked 3 Times in 2 Posts

Default

The original poster was asking about retriever tests, not pointing dog tests. An AKC Amateur or Open retriever field trial stake is in another (more difficult) universe than an AKC Master Hunt Test stake. Also, there is no "Winner" in a retriever hunt test. Theoretically all dogs entered can "Pass". In an AKC Field Trial stake there is only one "Winner".
Matt Mahoney is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 04-27-2022, 07:11 PM   #8
Member
Alfred Houde
PGCA Lifetime
Member

Member Info
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 825
Thanks: 193
Thanked 672 Times in 248 Posts

Default

Matt:

Thanks for answering my initial question regarding whistles. The rest is all good. I like them all and enjoy hearing about the pointing dogs too.
Alfred Houde is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 04-27-2022, 07:22 PM   #9
Member
Matt Mahoney
Forum Associate

Member Info
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Posts: 14
Thanks: 0
Thanked 3 Times in 2 Posts

Default

You're welcome Alfred.
Matt Mahoney is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 06:58 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © 1998 - 2023, Parkerguns.org
Copyright © 2004 Design par Megatekno
- 2008 style update 3.7 avec l'autorisation de son auteur par Stradfred.