Stuff

[Steve McCarty]

Originally Posted by Bill Murphy

Steve, what was the price of the William Bonney tintype that sold recently at auction? As I recall, it was very expensive.

Yup; the price was $2 million and with the fees Mr. Koch paid 2.3 million. As for my picture of the kid, which is a tintype....cost me $6.50. Actually I have two, the second cost me four bucks.

When I purchased these tintypes the seller didn't know who they were of, and I wasn't sure. It took me several years of research and the finding of Sallie Chisum's family who live not far from me in Oregon to nail down the connection. Their family had moved to Oregon, Troutdale, when Walter Pitzer Chisum died in 1919. Walter was Sallie Chisum's brother and is buried near her in Roswell, New Mexico. Walter's daughter, Ara was close to Sallie, who was Ara's aunt. Eventually Sallie gave her photo collection to Ara because she wanted to keep the images in her family. Her papers she gave to Lily Casey Klasner which became Eve Ball's book, My Girlhood Among the Outlaws. Ara showed some of the photos her two boys, Fred and Walter, but she kept the "bad men" secret, being embarrassed about her family's relationship to Billy the Kid.

[Steve McCarty]

Originally Posted by Mills Morrison

A true collector never worries about where he is going to put it.

I found my tintypes in a little antique store in Oregon. They were strewn willy nilly throughout the little store. Luckily I had read many books on the Kid and had traveled to Lincoln NM to study him and the images of his pals. Strangely I ran across these tintypes.

My fear is that after I die they will be lost again, and that would be a shame. I own original tintypes of almost all of the Regulators, two of the Kid and all of Sallie Chisum's family vise her uncle Pitzer Miller Chisum. I have pictures of John S. Chisum and his cousins the Towry's. I also have original and never before seen images of the Kid (2 of them), John Middleton, Frank McNab, Charlie Bowdre, Tom O. Folliard, Richard Brewer, Doc Scurlock, Alex McSween, Frank and George Coe and their wives, Godfrey Gauss, Alex McSween, Sheriff Brady, Bob Olinger, J.J. Dolan (copy of unknown original), Ira Leonard (the kid's attorney) Lily Casey Klasner, Matilda Davis (Brewer's girlfriend) and many, many more.

Some of my pictures are the only ones of that person extand including John Middleton, Frank McNab, Dirty Dave Rudabaugh, Billy Wilson and Yginio Salazar.

Sally Chisum collected all of these and saved them until before her death when she gave them to her brother's daughter who stored them in her attic. When she died in 1974, the photos were forgotten and sold in a yard sale. they ended up in a local antique shop. I came along and recognized them.

Pretty amazing, especially when one realizes that I dated Sallie Chisum's great granddaughter 40 years ago and that Billy McCarty may be a relative of mine, which has been a family legend all of my life.

Here is Tom O. Folliard, Billy's best friend who was killed by Sheriff Pat Garrett.

[John Farrell, Charter Member #33]

Attached photos of my deer buggy that is looking for a new home. It is in MN and can be driven to its new home or hauled away behind a pickup using the removable yoke frame. Includes a 2,500 lb. winch to get you out of tough spots. JF

[Bill Murphy]

So, Steve, what is the difference between your tintype and the 2.3 million dollar tintype? Inquiring minds......

[Steve McCarty]

Originally Posted by Bill Murphy

So, Steve, what is the difference between your tintype and the 2.3 million dollar tintype? Inquiring minds......

My tintype of the kid was taken at about the same time as the well known one. The Regulators visited the South Spring Ranch soon after the killings of Morton and Baker. I say this because I also have several pictures of Sallie that look similar. The photographer's name was George W. Morgan and the photo of Billy is so inscribed. I'll post it.

I also have a like picture of Richard Brewer who was killed on 4 April by Buckshot Roberts in the Blazer's Mill fight, which dates the picture.

I have two pictures of the Kid taken three years apart. In the first picture his visage is extremely clear and it is easy to match to the "Upham" photo that we all know. The later picture shows the kid in jail.

Here is my photo of Billy Bonney, aka Billy the Kid taken probably in March of 1878 at the South Spring Ranch by George W. Morgan.

[Steve McCarty]

I'll try to post a copy of my picture and the Upham one. Not sure I can do it tho. Okay, here is a detail of the Upham photo of Billy the Kid. My image and this one are reversed from the tintype, so Billy shows as he did in life. I don't think I need to pick out areas of similarity in the two pictures. Mine is much clearer, obviously. They are the same man.

[Steve McCarty]

Even the curles on his forehead match! In my picture he has closed his lips over his buck teeth. You can guess his age as well as I can. He does look innocent doesn't he. By this time in his life he has already killed one man and participated in the death of three others. Childish looking? Yep, Deadly? Yep.

[C.O.B.]

Have you considered donateing your collection to a museum? Might be a nice tax write off and it would at the least preserve a piece of American history.

The wife asked about the two boxes in the front entrance hall as they have been there a week. I told her they were shotgun shells. Her reply was to ask about the other four cases in the garage and I replied they were also shotgun shells. She just shook her head and asked that I put my stuff away. I haven't told her about the new gun

[Steve McCarty]

Originally Posted by Rich Anderson

Have you considered donateing your collection to a museum? Might be a nice tax write off and it would at the least preserve a piece of American history.

I have approached the Autry in southern Cal, the Cody in Wy, and the Smithsonian in DC offering to donate the collection which includes about 70 tintypes. No takers. They just don't believe the authenticity of the collection and when they call the "experts" their skepticism is given credence.

The experts don't like my provenance. I traced the collection back to Sallie Chisum's brother's family and they recall at least some of the photographs. Most were kept secret by Ara V. Chisum, Sallie's niece.

There is much more to this story. Book is in the works. I've got to go, but I'll have to post some more matches with my collection and known pictures of the same people.

[Mills]

The book should be interesting.