Newtown etc. effect on Gun Sales

[Setter Man]

I don't believe that I have contradicted myself nor do I believe army bases can be construed as "gun free zones." As to what I do to support the cause, that's my business. However I think I have made it pretty clear that I do not and will not support the NRA under their current administration. Furthermore I believe they have taken a tact that in the near future will actually do more to jeopardize our rights than to protect them. Bottom line, I believe in the power of the vote and the Bill of Rights.

At this point I am done with this thread. I have stated my case in very honestly and unequivocally. I don't expect many, if any of you to concur with my rationale and that is fine with me. Let's just not make this any more personal than some of you have already done. Although we disagree on the best approach we are all in this together.

[David Noble]

Jay, I speak for myself here and I suspect many others, though we have differing opinions, your input is appreciated and respected. I too wish things had not gotten personal.
I wish you a Merry Christmas.
David

[Dennis]

The soldiers at Fort Hood were not allowed to be armed which does indeed make it a gun free zone. As for the 20 year old elementary school teacher being armed my feeling is that if she wants to accept that responsibility AND has appropriate training then why should she not be armed. My God, we have armed 18 year old men and women in combat right now. Apparently they seem to do OK. We have all seen 6 year old children that are responsible and do very well shooting firearms in a safe manner. We have also seen 50 year old men who I would not be in the area with if they had a loaded gun. As for the NRA and WL speaking out, what would we have them do, just roll over and give in to the anti gunners? I hope not. In my experience with anti gunners they lie about their true intentions every time they open their mouth. "We don't want to take away your firearms, just make it harder for the criminals and crazy people to obtain guns. We are only going after the semi automatic military type assault rifle types." Listen to the people on any of the news channels. An anti gun person on O'Reilly the other night said he wanted to close the, "order a gun through the Internet loophole." There is no loophole as we all know but him saying that makes it sound to any other citizen who isn't in the gun hobby thinks any of us can simply go online to Rock River Arms and order a machine gun. Please don't believe that another assault weapons ban will be the end of the upcoming harassment from Senators Dianne Feinstein, Chuck Schumer or President Obama. It is the start of much more. When these people divide us and say they aren't after the hunting guns but only the assault weapons AND if we fall for it we deserve what we get.

I collect many types of firearms from assault type guns that I use to shoot targets and tin cans, hunting and collect, to Winchester Model 70's, side by side shotguns, handguns of all types etc. We need to open up our eyes and pay attention because these bans are coming and there will be nothing we can do to stop them. President Obama has already said there will be meaningful discussion with regard to firearms, mental health issues and whatever else can stop these needless killings of innocent citizens. But mark my words, there will be only lip service paid to the other causes of movie violence, Nintendo game violence and mental health issues. It is a ruse. There will only be banning guns. I wish us all luck but common sense will not be a part of the ban.

[Big Friend Ten (BFT)]

For anyone who doesn’t like the NRA there are plenty of alternatives. Voting isn’t enough especially if one votes for left-leaning politicians! We all need to do more than vote.

I also suggest to all to get involved by writing to our elected US Congressmen of Congresswomen and Senators. Get involved!

If all one does is vote once a year and then complain about elected politicians and the NRA then they might as well surrender their firearms now.

We all need to stick together. You may do so by joining any of these alternatives to the NRA, AND BY WRITING TO YOUR CONGRESSIONAL LEADERS!!!

National Association for Gun Rights
http://www.nationalgunrights.org/

Gun Owners of America
http://gunowners.org/

Second Amendment Foundation
http://www.saf.org/

Michigan Coalition for Responsible Gun Ownership
http://www.mcrgo.org/mcrgo/d_president.asp

Jews for the Preservation of Firearms Ownership
http://jpfo.org/

Gun Owners Action League
http://www.goal.org/

Women Against Gun Control
http://www.wagc.com/

Pink Pistols
http://pinkpistols.org/

PS: I am a member of both the NRA and the National Association for Gun Rights. I found the other organizations listed above in a simple Google search. It really isn’t hard to get involved.

[King Brown]

My view from north of the border is that LaPierre was talking to his constituency, not a country confused, alarmed and absolutely broken-hearted. I would have preferred---if he were speaking for me---a more measured response under the circumstances, as Boehner did introducing his party's sort of "We'll give the President's plan a look and see what's best for the country." LaPierre's and Boehner's supporters know they're not to be turned. The NRA lost a chance to look good.

[Dennis]

I am wondering what Wayne LaPierre and the NRA could have done to look good. I don't think the NRA would look good under any circumstances. I have supported the NRA for probably 50 years and will continue to do so. In my experience the NRA has been demonized forever by anti gun people and organizations as have SUV's and tobacco. I have done some research on gun violence and death by any type of firearm is far less than one percent in America. More people die by drowning than by firearms. Our President says he will do whatever it takes to stop even one more death by firearms. If that is his thinking than we surely ought to take airplanes out of the sky, cars off the road, total ban on smoking in that tobacco will not be permitted to be grown. President Obama went to Newtown, CT for the town goodwill but I don't see him saying a word, not one, about the 500 people who were killed by gunfire in his town of Chicago. Let's remember that Chicago has some of the strictest gun laws in the nation. Our politicians think that if there is a problem just pass a law. Sorry but that doesn't seem to work.

I apologize for going off on a rant and I feel sadness and pain for any death in America because of any reason, especially gunfire. My own son died of a self inflicted gunshot because of the death of his sister a few years earlier and because he started using drugs. So who or what do I blame, the death of his sister, drugs, guns, society, his school teachers? No. I blame my son. He made the choice to take his life. Believe me, I have been there and done that. Knocking the NRA because of the deaths at Newtown or anywhere else is not the answer. As someone else mentioned what else is there. Without the NRA you can kiss your Parkers and any other guns goodby. Your .243 with a scope will be a demonized sniper rifle.

Dennis

[Big Friend Ten (BFT)]

I'd like to share with everyone an opinion article by West Virginia Senator Joe Manchin. The Senator is a right leaning democrat who, if I lived in his state, would get my vote! He is also a former governor of his state.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinio...278_story.html

[King Brown]

Dennis, here's my way of looking at it: it was a bad blow for everyone everywhere. It wasn't felt differently in Canada or a village near Rome. It was an awful sadness at our special time of the year. It was no time for making points, numbers and comparisons. I thought of Antoine de Saint Exupery's words in Le Petit Prince that it is only with the heart that we can see rightly, as the essence of things is not visible to the eye. I don't know what LaPierre is like in person but his TV persona is "hot" when what was needed in these circumstances is "cool."

[Bruce Day]

I shot an M16, full auto, it was lots of fun to spray the target. I found that I was even able to hit the target a couple times out of a 15 round magazine when I shot fast.

I shot an M60 50cal BMG, boy what a feeling of firepower.

I pulled the lanyard on some type of Korean War army cannon. Wow what a blast.

People used to be able to freely buy those Thompson sub-machine guns after WWI until they were generally prohibited and available only to Class III permit holders who want to pay the license fees, like the full auto versions of the M/AR 15, 16.

So I know the constitution gives me a right "to keep and bear arms" for the purpose of being ready to be called up to a well regulated militia to support the security of the state. I know that's what the second amendment says, but it sure is confusing since we have had since 1900 these big armies, navies and police departments and the state militias---the national guard . I suppose that also means that I can bear arms to be secure in my home and for hunting, and I suppose reasonable recreation, although it sure was fun to blast away with the cannon and those full auto machine guns. And it may be fun to shoot one of those AR 15's that will shoot as fast as you can move your finger, almost as fast as full auto. I guess I could make an argument that I need arms like bazookas, mortars and that M60 at home too, just in case I am called up for the militia in case the Rooskies, infidels, or whoever invade. I know I fall in the regulated category as a military retiree.


But here's what I figure I need to be secure in my home, and for hunting and for reasonable recreation. Maybe others feel the need for lots of firepower, I don't walk in their shoes or know what's lurking behind their doors.

Bruce Day
NRA member and cert. shot gun and pistol instructor

[OH Osthaus]

Bruce, if it does gets down to very limited ownership - that is a great set to have -