Shooting hammer guns

[Lloyd McKissick]

Thank you Mr. Romig, appreciate that input.

"Composite" instead of Damascus for a "Twist" description eh? Ok, I also have an early Best Laminated Steel LC Smith gun, is that considered a "composite" variety as well?

Also, in earlier discussions here I see the subject of hunting with the hammers cocked but with the gun being open. I have tried that and found it to be somewhat awkward and even slow. It may be a blasphemous admission here, but if I'm alone (and on mostly clear and level ground), my tubes are "hot" (i.e., gun closed, at port arms, hammers cocked). Hunting ruffed grouse with a hammergun almost demands this approach.

Mind you, this is only when things are feeling "birdy". If I'm hunting with a partner, my hammers are down until either a point or a flush are detected (or I've reverted to using a hammerless weapon).

Edit to add: as my footing inevitably becomes less-sure as I age, then I'll further revise this practice (or abandon it altogether).

[Dean Romig]

IMO any gun barrels manufactured with alternating blades or wires of iron and steel rather than “fluid steel” are by definition composite.





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[Lloyd McKissick]

Fair enough, but where does the use of the term "Damascus" then become appropriate? Only for 2-bar, 3-bar, or Crolle?

So...you're a Setter man?

[Dean Romig]

IMO the term Damascus describes alternating bundles of blades or wires of iron and steel twisted together and wound in groups of two, three, four, five or six around (hammer welded) a mandrel to form some kind of crolle pattern (“pattern-welded”). Bernard Steel barrels fall into this category as the same method is used in making them. Twist and Laminated are not…

Drew Hause may come on and give us his opinion on this. I always welcome and respect his contributions on this subject, as it is his forte.



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[Dean Romig]

Yup, I’m definitely a setter man but I lost my sweet Gracie in January of ‘24 to cancer at age 9 1/2 and chose not to take her grandson when he was offered to us. I’m 77 and wouldn’t do a young setter justice in the field…



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[Jay Oliver]

I have always looked at this as Dean posted earlier. Damascus is a type of composite barrel...

[Lloyd McKissick]

Mr. Romig: Never easy to lose a good dog (& a longtime family member), my condolences.

I'm not disagreeing with your assessment (as technically they are all "composites"), I'm just trying to understand the distinctions.

I already knew that laminated steel was a different creative process then more-standard Damascus forms (& clearly, different visually as well). Twist, however, is/was (at least as I presently understand it) technically the same as the other Damascus types, but it somehow doesn't/didn't include the added effort up-front (more-complex stacking before forging and then twisting) to get those more-intricate and complex patterns, and because of that it was always less-expensive (less human effort involved equals less cost to manufacture) and was accordingly, usually deployed on the more entry-level guns. To your point, however, "Twist" is clearly visually different from the others as well...so you might be onto something here.


3-Bar Damascus

Twist

Laminated Steel

The odd thing here however, is that while "Twist" was always considered to be the least "strong" of the Damascus variants, Laminated Steel is/was considered to be the "strongest" of them all, with upwards of 70% steel in its composition. The Proof House tests in England in the early 1890s also bore that out.

It'll be interesting to hear what Dr. Drew has to say on the subject.

[Dean Romig]

I believe you’re probably right concerning the process of manufacturing Twist tubes.






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[Lloyd McKissick]

It's interesting to me to see that even here, folks are still frightful about using "composite" shotgun barrels (as you call them). I've owned, shot, and hunted going-on a dozen of these Damascus guns since those Sherman Bell articles were published in the mid-1990s and I've never had an issue with any of them. Fear is a funny thing, isn't it, even in the face of solid scientific (& even British) proof.

So-many guns had their beautiful Damascus barrels butchered or replaced just so they could be sold here....it's just a shame. Oh well, it made for exceptionally good buys on those guns for me for many years (I suppose I should be greatful for the whorish "sporting press" [doing the bidding of the big gunmakers during the Great Depression] for publishing those baseless articles in the 1930s and 40s ).

[Big D]

Cynic that I am, I keep imagining that somewhere there was a letter circulated to all the gun/barrel manufacturers that said "Now that we know how to make cheaper one-piece barrels, let's all send out warnings about how unsafe composite barrels are, and we'll all make more money"