Forum Proposal

[Ray Masciarella]

Thanks, Dean, but I can't find it. I see where it says if the gun is listed elsewhere "please let us know" but I don't see an express prohibition. Does "please let us know" mean simultaneous listing is prohibited? I thought it meant a seller had to mention the other listing in the post.

[Dean Romig]

Maybe John will define the rule for us.

[Ray Masciarella]

This is an example of a rule so unclear and ambiguous that it is susceptible two reasonable but wholly different interpretations. One that has the potential of creating an unnecessary burden on the Admin/Mod and frustration for the members. I know it is human nature to resist change but our forum benefit if rules were written such that they have only one meaning, eg, "a member shall not list a gun for sale on the PGCA forum while simultaneously offering it for sale on any other website" vs. "if you are also posting the same item for sale on another website, or advertising it somewhere else, please let us know." Of course this assumes that the language of the rule pointed out is the part that prohibits simultaneous listings.

[Dean Romig]

It seems to me that the only people who might be really upset by the possibility of someone who doesn't own the gun being offered for sale through this Members Only "Guns For Sale" page would be those who joined the PGCA only to become a 'member' for the sole purpose to be able to buy or sell guns on the forum. I just can't understand why anyone else would be upset by the moderators' or the administrator's bending of the guidelines or policies governing the use of the Guns For Sale page in order to facilitate an unusual circumstance presented by a PGCA member.

[John D.]

This is simply ridiculous.

First - we are "not bending" any rules...

Second - why would I even consider putting into place more restrictive rules, that are even MORE unenforceable, unless you folks are going to police each and every posting in the For Sale forum?

Third - the existing rule is simple: ".."if you are also posting the same item for sale on another website, or advertising it somewhere else, please let us know..". In short - it's common courtesy and ethically correct to let folks know if you have it listed elsewhere - like DoubleGun, or GunsInternational or.. Wherever. And you want to change that to: "..a member shall not list a gun for sale on the PGCA forum while simultaneously offering it for sale on any other website..." Tell me - who would be able to enforce that by checking all the "other website"(s) on the Internet?!

Fourth - it is really simple to incorrectly hypothecate, as you don't know any better, nor care to know any better - that we "bend the rules", or we are two-faced or - whatever we've been accused of on this thread (it's a LONG list) - as, you folks have no idea what you are talking about. It's Internet "banter" and must be somewhat "titillating" for you all to spend so much time focused on it - but, in fact - on Nov 4 2013 - I warned, in private - the individual whose post Mark deleted specifically about posting in the PGCA FS WITHOUT NOTICE simultaneously on multiple sites. Do you folks think you are somehow magically entitled to know of each private warning between myself and another Member? I don't think so...

Should Mark have divulged that private information? I don't think so...

This is easy....

1) If you don't like the rules of the PGCA For Sale Forum - don't post your guns for sale there.

2) Before you accuse ANYONE of favoritism, not equally enforcing the rules that currently exist, blah, blah, blah - try acting like a gentleman and contacting me, or any of the MODs in private. Public "Lynch Mob" threads really don't turn out too well unless you know exactly the background, depth and what we are actually "doing" - most of which will NOT be posted in public. And only three people - Jeff, Mark and myself know exactly what actions we take "in private" to equally enforce all the rules and conduct on this Forum - not just the For Sale Forum.. To be frank - you are not invited to eavesdrop on those "private" conversations - nor is it appreciated when folks take it upon themselves to "gossip" about baseless and ill-informed speculation.

3) I am not adverse to change - but that change has to be an improvement, not a regression. To put into place another "rule" which is more open to "abuse" is really silly - unless you are the one who wants to enforce it.

4) This entire thread is pretty much a re-hash of this thread:
http://parkerguns.org/forums/showthread.php?t=10024
Which - again - is simply amazing as it deals with the Forum Rules about posting guns for sale, etc..

5) I've got to be honest - if you folks want to improve the site - this is not the way to undertake productive change. One would probably think that a more productive approach would be private discussions, where events that shaped the current "rules" can be discussed?

6)... Ahhh - there is no "6". I'm done with this discussion as I'm certain it's "falling on deaf ears", as it were..

Have a great day.

John

[OH Osthaus]

there was a saying where I used to live in PA about folks that always had a complaint -

"some people wouldn't be happy if they was hung with a new rope"

John - by now no one can complain they did not have their say (which is different than getting your way)- so maybe time to lock it down and get back to Parkers.

[John D.]

Originally Posted by Rick Losey

...John - by now no one can complain they did not have their say (which is different than getting your way)- so maybe time to lock it down and get back to Parkers.

I left it open through the day to accommodate any responses.

It is now closed.

My thanks Rick and all...

- John