Very hard to believe. Could it be true?

[Autumn Daze]

Please don,t take this as a knock of Fox guns.They are great guns and if I wasn,t so deep with Parkers the Fox would be my gun of choice. Bo-Whoop is a Fox gun" albiet a very famous one" My logic here is that Fox guns do not historically bring the $ Parkers do. Do you guys think that in this case provenance will grossly outweigh the value of this gun if it was a Fox owned by "Joe Blow"?

[John Truitt]

IMHO:
I think the gun will go for figures close to if not higher than the Czars gun, despite the economy.
Provenance is the key as well as all of the hype surronding this gun regarding its disapperance.

By the way doesnt the gun have made for Nash Buckingham engraved on it.

[Researcher]

The legend on the barrels is hand stamped with individual letters --



She is a well worn old fowling piece, but she was used by Nash to 21 or 22 years. The Czar never saw his alledged Parker Bros. double, and likely had no hint of its existance.

[Dean Romig]

[QUOTE=Dean Romig;8551]Or has it lain hidden in obscurity all this time because whoever picked it up on the roadside knew who it belonged to and knew himself to be a dishonest coward to have kept Bo-Whoop... ?QUOTE]

Thanks Researcher, I rest my case.

[John Truitt]

Its a damn shame. I can only imagine how Mr. Buckingham must have felt when he lost Bo Whoop. That gun must have felt like an extension and piece of him. I am sure that was a terribel feeling that I hope none of us here ever have to feel. It really makes me sad to think about how many years and hunts that gun missed with the person it was made for.

[Jim Kucaba]

If I did it correctly, the photo of Nash Buckingham's Bo Whoop that's posted on the Julia Auctions website should appear in this post ... I hope Jim Julia Doesn't mind my posting the photo here.

Jim Kucaba ... AriZOona Cactus Patch ... Email: JimKucaba@aol.com

[Old and Reliable]

My first question to the Fox/TNB/Bo-Whoop cognoscenti here would be: Does this Fox HE made for TNB in 1927 have the "No Guaranteed" stamping on the barrel flats, as apparently some of the HE Fox guns did- meaning "Pattern" not the integrity of the barrel steel and construction.??

I have always held the late Nash Buckingham to be the "Top Shelf" of genteel Sportsmen no longer with us- and that list includes Paul Curtis, Hal Sheldon, William H. Foster, Ray P. Holland, Corey Ford and Gene Hill- and you will note they were all esteemed writers as well. I am fortunate to have many of their books in original editions, treasures I read and re-read oft times.

Part of the reason for my high regard for Nash was his loyalty to his friends, and his gracious Southern manners and respect for all ladies, not just his beloved wife Irma Witt Jones Buckingham. My late GrandFather taught me that you can judge the character of a man by how he treats his wife, his children and his bird dogs- Amen to that.

I recently bought (privately) a Fox 20 Sterlingworth- a Philadelphia mfg. gun with 26" open bored barrels, double triggers and extractors, unaltered, original black buttplate, about 85% blue and wood finish, 60% color casehardening- mechanically perfect 6 lbs. a great upland gun for shooting over a solid pointing dog indeed. I don't normally disclose what I have paid for a gun, anymore than I show my hole cards in poker to the man who folded his hand and surrendered the pot to me- But because the Fox/Parker value question was raised, the same party had a Meriden mfg. Parker VH 20 bore, size 0 frame, 28" Vulcan Steel barrels, DT., extractors for sale it has been sold now) in about the same very good condition as the Fox- and he was asking $3000 for the Parker--

As to whether the "Bo-Whoop" gun was "stolen" or "kept without looking for the proper owner"- and with his name clearly stamped on the barrel breech area, the gun was his property, and every effort should be made to return it to his heirs. The other guns he owned and sold while he was living, including the M21 "Award gun" and the second Becker 12 Magnum, sold to Dr. Andrews, that is indeed another situation, IMO.

His grandchildren should benefit from the sale of this historic shotgun, Nash stood for honor and decency and sportsmanship, this is the only right thing to do.

Why in Heaven's name did the "game agent" need to check a double gun for a three shot plug and would he think a gentleman of Nash's prestige would NOT have a valid hunting license and waterfowling stamp?

I recall two "Fox" experiences from past days- I had owned a altered 12 HE- 32" Full and extra Full- loved to use it for barn Pigeons when they return to silo, they usually have some altitude, but that Fox "nailed 'em"--it was so well fitted that it would not close completely on my reloads AA red hulls, only on factory new ones-I have since replaced it with a LC Smith 2E with 32" ventilated rib barrels- 2.5 lbs. lighter

My late GrandFather, who hunted with both 12 Parkers and a hammer 12 bore Purdey, had a close friend who owned a DE 12 Fox-we were out for pheasants one Saturday in early November, my Grandfather had picked up some Rem. 12 paper No. 6's at Howell & Clement Friday evening- Mr. Bontrager's Fox would NOT close with those new Remingtons- fortunately, he had some Ranger shells and those worked- My GrandFather later "miked" the brass heads and the unfired Remington shells were 0.0015" larger in dia. than the Ranger shells that worked in his friend's high grade Fox-!!

[Old and Reliable]

[QUOTE=Dave Noreen;8618]The legend on the barrels is hand stamped with individual letters --



She is a well worn old fowling piece, but she was used by Nash to 21 or 22 years. The Czar never saw his alledged Parker Bros. double, and likely had no hint of its existance.[\

I wonder if those stamped letters were really done by the hands of the late B. Becker- or a 'counterfeit'-I have a lady friend who is a forensic handwriting expert, I am going to show her a printed copy of this.

Even to my inexperienced eyes, the left barrel characters and alignment vary from those evidenced on the right barrel. Also, this special Fox for TNB was made in 1927- when Burt Becker might have been at his "prime"- GBE reported that he made exehibition grade guns for Parker and Remington. he might have resorted to this rather "sloppy' and mis-aligned hand stamping under a recoil pad or inside the forearm- but to mark up a very high grade and engraved Fox with this type of "stamping"? raises a question to my layman's eyes-

Also, GBE mentioned in "Mr. Buck's guns" that the first Becker had a distinctive top lever configuration- Granted, the late GBE wasn't the AH Fox-ist that a Michael McIntosh might seem to be, BUT- GBE did start his bird hunting career with a 12 Sterlingworth, prior to his being bequeathed a 12 bore Purdey-

Also, when did Fox start the 'Barrels Not Guaranteed' stamp on the barrel flats- a "marketing error?" that may have mis-lead potential Fox buyers into thinking their Chromox steel tubes might fail under shooting conditions?? I believe what Fox may have meant to say was "Pattern percentages NOT Guaranteed"-- anyway, I'm sure not a player at this table either, stakes will be way too high for me- IF this gun is indeed the first "Bo-Whoop"--

[Don Kaas]

First, I hope both the Buckingham heirs, TNB's insurance company (whomever they were) seller, Julias and buyer end up happy. Where are the routine roll stamp markings? Even if the current markings were added (by or for NB) later the original barrel stampings or traces of them would exist. All other known Philadelphia Foxes that Becker worked on are marked with Fox barrel markings and nother other than a few stamp markings know to be used by Becker. Other well known Becker stocking touches are absent as well on this re-stocked gun. Most of the opinions on this gun I have read are by people who have never even seen a Becker made gun in the hand let alone owned one. It would be like a DHE Parker leaving Meriden in 1928 stamped "Made for Nash Buckingham by James Geary, Meriden, CT". This was a Fox factory ordered and shipped gun that Becker (who was merely a contractor there) may have had a hand in making. Unlike Bo Whoop II it was not a post 1932 "Becker" gun made and marked by him using a factory gun I hope this gun is Bo Whoop and I hope someone CAN prove this is Bo Whoop but right now the provenance of this gun is suspect but it is a factory HE/XE with out doubt. Many historical and physical contradictions exist, however When Dave is convinced, I'll be more convinced. If Tom Kidd says it is even better. Right now this is a Fox XE/HE that is thought to be Bo Whoop. As for Parkers being worth more than Foxes, TR's 1909 safari F grade changed hands privately for $450,000 almost 10 years ago. One of the most famous US presidents on the most famous safari ever taken and a gift gun that made the trip with absolutely impeccable provenance.
-Written from the shores of Beaver Dam Lake, Tunica, MS 12-09-09

[greenhornet]

can someone please tell me what load BoWoop was made for
I beleive it was winchester super x #4's does anybody know the speed and oz.
thanks