Gunbroker and Computer Virus'?

[Old and Reliable]

Bill is right- Luddite was a religious based sect that started in PA about the time of the oil from the ground era (maybe 1856?) and that group opposed any form of progress- they were used to whale oil for their lamps- Kaszinski, a 190 IQ perhaps, math major at the very prestigious U of M--dropped out, became a hermit and also opposed computers and other "blessings" of the more modern age- My "lack of understanding" about computers is not only a reflection on my age (HS grad 1960) but because of all the advances to criminal exterprises it has accelerated-

It might have been the late Will Rodgers who said "Some folks rob you with a gun, some use a fountain pen" and today we can substitute the computer and the Internet for that fountain pen.

If you have had military EOD training (mine was at Courthouse Bay Engr. School USMC Cam LeJeune NC) you have to marvel at how old hermit boy Teddy assembled his bombs in a one room cabin w/o electricity, and knowing how the baggage smashers have infested the USPS, that they didn't detonate until opened up by the chosen at random victim(s)--

Yup- gas axe or the "blue tipped wrench" are trade names from the welding field- just as "Hippie rod" (AWS code 7010) and "The Arkansas Bellhole" for certifying to API in the 5G position with a 45% bend to the joint axis--

[Bill Bolyard]

Francis,

They actually started in England, Here is a brief description I lifted off of Google,

"The Luddite movement, which began in 1811 and 1812 when mills and pieces of factory machinery were burned by handloom weavers, took its name from the fictive Ned Ludd. For a short time the movement was so strong that it clashed in battles with the British Army. Measures taken by the British government included a mass trial at York in 1812 that resulted in many executions and penal transportations.

The principal objection of the Luddites was against the introduction of new wide-framed automated looms that could be operated by cheap, relatively unskilled labour, resulting in the loss of jobs for many skilled textile workers."

Bill

[Don Reed]

Originally Posted by Francis Morin

When my daughter set up this Dell computer thing, she got the Norton anti-virus-- I still see junk mail in that denoted folder, lotsa strange "ladies" want me to see their fotos, etc--I just hit the old Cancel button and away it goes into the T.S. Eliot Wasteland I guess-

Another daughter and her husband got a wireless Dell computer laptop thing, they didn't opt for the anti-virus protection or Spam filtering, and Geoff got zapped on both E-Bay and the Gun brokerage web sites- cost them $ to have their unit "de-bugged"- and he also got hit with E-Bay fraud on that PayPally gizmo- they got his bank account and routing numer-- Big FUBAR.

Being an old fashioned "Luddite" I suppose, I would take my few Parkers etc. to the scrap yard and let them cut the barrels with the "gas axe" before I would ever trade on any of those websites-too many risks for my $--

I got rid of the Norton anti-virus for my computer and now use AVG, installed by my computer repairman after he had to scrub mine up afer being badly infected. I've had no problems ever since.
I joined PayPal some time ago. A couple of weeks later, my credit card company fraud unit rep. called me to see if I had authorized an $800.00 Western Union money order. I told them "No." She said it looked fishy and told me to cut up my credit card and they would send me a new one, which they did. I remembered responding to a validation check of my PayPal acct. shortly before this all happened. It evidently was not actually PayPal. Someone hacked my acct., and tried to steal the money. It is really hard to know what is correct anymore.
As far as GunBroker, I've not had any problems as previously described at all. In fact I very recently bought a real nice 1927 Sterlingworth (excuse the term) there, and had 0 problems.......

[Old and Reliable]

Sounds like you did OK on the AH Fox Sterlingworth. One of the many nice things about being a PGCA member, we have a section here for discussion of other doubles. I bought privately two Non-Parker doubles: A 20 Sterlingworth with 26" barrels, DT and extractors SN 261981 last November, and early this Month a 16 gauge M21 skeet with 26" barrels, SST and AE SN 20033- This very generous situation from our BOD saves us $, we can get information from brother Parkerites about our Non-Parkers and not have to pay the membership and search letter fees.

I know there is a AH Fox Assn., not sure about the Model 21, whether it is a entity unto itself, or is part of a greater Winchester Assn.--

How did you determine the year of mfg. of your Fox Sterlingworth? Mine has the Utica New York barrel markings, but the stock, grip, checkering, buttplate, outline engraving (graver stroll?)are identical to a good friend who has a 16 AH Fox Sterlingworth with the earlier Phila. Penn. barrel markings.

I am "spitballing here" but I don't believe Winchester made any numerical block distinctions between the 12, 16, and 20 gauge M21's from 1931 until 1960 at least. It is my understanding that AH Fox Co. assigned a block of numbers by both gauges, and also differentiating the Sterlingworth guns from the higher Grades with Alpha prefixes, whether ejector or not.

Another friend has a BE 12 bore AH Fox with Krupp barrels, original wood and metal finish and case colorings, and although it is not a Parker, it is indeed a finer gun. For some strange reason, the barrels are an even 29.5" dead on, but uncut vis a vis the ribs, solder and also the .729" NBD and the .025" choke right barrel and .037" choke in the left. It does have 2.625" shorter chambers, so he wisely shoots RST 2.5" shells in it.

My 20 has 2.75" chambers, I don't know the restrictions as to the chokes, but with 7/8 oz. No. 9 AA skeet loads it patterns about the same at 35 yards 30" circle as does the 16 M21 skeet with 1 oz. target loads.

To my way of thinking, choke "fussiness" and choke tubes are not the more critical aspects of a good shooting double- stock fit including pitch, barrel length and balance to the gun overall, and great trigger(s) and proper mechanics- safety, ejectors in time, etc-- are all more important--

By being "balanced to the gun" I mean this: a gentleman who requires a 15" LOP on his field gun, regardless of gauge (at least 12, 16 and 20 gauges) a set of 26" long barrels might seem out of proportion. And a M21 Duck Gun with 32" long barrels would seem equally out of proportion with a stock shortened to 13" for a Lady or a youth shooter-- IMO only!!

[Don Reed]

....Francis.....Thanks for your reply and information. I really appreciate learning more and more about fine double guns. As far as getting serialization info, you might try typing "Double barreled shotguns, high grade shotgun dates of production" into your search bar on your Internet page. It will give you several search sites, and you pick which places are relevant to you. It gives a wealth of info on production dates for nearly all the major double manufacturers. Parkers, Foxes, Smiths, etc., etc..... all there.. I believe it's sponsored by Doublegun..... Don.