No Serial Number, can’t sell in Colorado:

[Larry the Gun Guy]

Obviously, this law and others like it are not pointed at the antiques and C&Rs out there. They're focused on the black gun crowd and all others just get painted with that brush. If you think the states like Kalifornia, New York, Illinois and Colorado are passing these gun laws to please we sportsman, hunters, shooters and collectors they are not. They are doing just the opposite to harass all gun owners and provide as much discouragement as possible, hoping we'll all think it's too much trouble to own a gun and give them up; IMHO...

BTW, I just copied that off of some attorney's web site.

[6pt-Sika]

Originally Posted by Larry Stauch

Obviously, this law and others like it are not pointed at the antiques and C&Rs out there. They're focused on the black gun crowd and all others just get painted with that brush. If you think the states like Kalifornia, New York, Illinois and Colorado are passing these gun laws to please we sportsman, hunters, shooters and collectors they are not. They are doing just the opposite to harass all gun owners and provide as much discouragement as possible, hoping we'll all think it's too much trouble to own a gun and give them up; IMHO...

BTW, I just copied that off of some attorney's web site.

Used to be AR uppers weren’t serialized now if I’m not mistaken the ATF made it necessary for new manufacture uppers to be serialized . Think that came about in the last year or two .

[J. A. EARLY]

From page one and the attorney's website Larry copied:

"Unlawful conduct involving an unsterilized firearm is a class 1 misdemeanor, carrying a penalty of up to 364 days in jail."

So make sure you boil your gun each time before going out.

[Bruce P Bruner]

Considering that every non-serialized firearm will require serialization and a background check, it seems to be a huge inconvenience and a money grab.
What’s stopping me from purchasing at stamp set and dreaming up a number? It’s obviously less expensive. I can invent a number just as well a “smith”.

[B. Dudley]

Well, federally, you cannot just stamp a serial number. It is illegal to alter a numner or put one on it unless you are a manufacturer or you apply to the ATF for a serial number and they provide you with one.

And regarding NICS checks, they are done by a dealer regardless of if there is a serial number or not. It is if any firearm is sold. And the serial number is not communicated to the NICS at any time of the process.

[Nick de Guerre]

This is assinine. This law should have been written to say "guns made AFTER Jan 1st, 1969, require serial numbers."

NDG

[David Noble]

My gun store was undergoing an ATF compliance check about 7 years ago. One of the agents came across an Eli Whitney 32 rimfire revolver made in the 1870’s and asked why it was not not tagged with a bound book number. I explained that it was an antique and was not required to be entered into the bound book. The reply was that by law, if there was ammunition available in the normal channels of business it could not be considered an antique. I replied that you cannot readily buy ammo in that caliber as it hasn’t been manufactured for forty or fifty years. The agent said original ammo is on Gunbroker occasionally, and so it needed to be entered in my books. Trying to argue a point with an ATF agent is rarely worth the outcome. It took me a couple of years to sell the gun because no one, including C&R holders wanted to hassle with doing paperwork and background checks to get it. I ended up selling it at a loss to another dealer. I doubt that dealer logged it into his books, but it got it off of mine.
On a side note, I asked the agent about all the antique Colt SSA’s that were always being offered for sale online and at gun shows and gun stores with no FFL required or background checks. The answer was those were illegal sales.

[Mike Poindexter]

Bruce, I have not read the ghost gun legislation, but I did read the 3 day wait period legislation and it exempts anything antique or C&R eligible under federal law. I suspect the ghost gun legislation does also. Most of the gunshops that should know better choose to err on the side of self-preservation and treat all cartridge guns as "firearms" regardless of their age. I took the printed 3 day wait statute down to my LGS and showed them the language, but they wouldn't budge. The Colorado Gun Collectors Assoc. has figured it out, and in order to avoid the 3 day wait period they have restricted sales at the annual show in May to only antiques and C&R eligible guns. I bought a Fox Model B made pre'68 a few years ago and it, of course, had no serial number although there were a bunch of large capital letters factory stamped all over the frame and barrel flats. I just had an antique Lefever F grade shipped directly to my house with no problem either. Bottom line, you are at the mercy of the gunshops for local consignment sales and they are running scared. Sell it on GI or GB and ship it directly to the buyer. Knock wood, I have never had a problem with USPS Priority Mail delivering a long gun, although I always break them down and ship in a compartmented heavy cardboard box. Good luck!

[Mike Poindexter]

Just looked up the text of the bill. As I suspected, antiques under federal law and C&R eligible (although they missed the 50 year provision and went instead with 1968 or prior manufacture) are exempt.. Here is the quoted exemption language from SB 23-279:
(II) THE FIREARM INVOLVED HAS BEEN RENDERED PERMANENTLY
6 INOPERABLE; IS A DEFACED FIREARM, AS DESCRIBED IN SECTION
7 18-12-103; IS AN ANTIQUE FIREARM, AS DEFINED IN 18 U.S.C. SEC. 921
8 (a)(16); OR WAS MANUFACTURED BEFORE OCTOBER 22, 1968.

Like I said, the gunshops that should know better, don't.

[Nick de Guerre]

Mike, well done. That explains it...just dumb gun store guys.
I cant recall whether there was an explicit compliance date on the 1968 Act. I do know that I have read that most companies were compliant by Jan 1969.

People often say "pre-1968," when really they should say "pre-1969."

NDG