Defining a Parker Long Range shotgun

[Cold Spring]

Originally Posted by henderson Marriott

Frank,
Nice VHE Parker. Appears that it might resemble the very nice 1924 VHE
waterfowl shotgun that graces the front cover of the Winter 2021 issue of Parker Pages.
You have managed to locate some excellent sources
for both Parkers and the occasional Fox.

Ridge, actually it's the other way around. I've been a long time Fox nut (mainly) and thus it's been Foxes and the occasional Parker and Lefever, both of which I'd come to appreciate and look for good ones. The VHE 32" on the front cover of the Winter '21 PP edition is in very high condition and probably unfired since leaving Meriden. The VHE 32" referred to here is in lesser condition, having been used over the water.

Those following this thread may be interested in an upcoming article in the DGJ that elaborates on the 1919-22 experimentation with 12-gauge/3-inch progressive shells and "borings" for the Special Long Range waterfowl guns, in particular the Super-Fox and the somewhat underappreciated LC Smith Long Range. It’s likely to be in the Summer edition.

[Researcher]

Thanks Frank. It would be great if those Remington 3-inch guns I pictured above could pass through your hands at least long enough for some of your good measurements. Actually, when those Remington guns were made, we were into the age of the 12-gauge 3-inch Magnum 1 5/8-ounce loads

[Cold Spring]

Originally Posted by Dave Noreen

Thanks Frank. It would be great if those Remington 3-inch guns I pictured above could pass through your hands at least long enough for some of your good measurements.

Dave, I'd love to do that with my Super-Fox chamber length and taper gauges and with the bore mike. If anyone has one to bring to the Northeast SxS please let me know so I bring my tools. Truck is starting to get pretty full.

[charlie cleveland]

nothing stirs my blood like talking about these 3 inch guns be it 12 ga or 16 ga or 20 ga...they are special too me....charlie

[charlie cleveland]

this gun must of used the 3 inch 16 ga shell...bill murphy has a big 16 ga gun also...I like hearing about these heavy weight guns....charlie

[Craig Larter]

2704 Long Range and Wild Fowl LCS were made.

[Double Lab]

Just my 2cents......

To me a lot of the long range, super dooper duck crushers were merely marketing hype. Not that they didn't work. They worked well with the components available at the time. But they were developed in the era of softer shot using fiber wads and the new smokeless powder which was really in it's infancy. Todays offerings make these old duck crushers even more effective. But they also work very well in these old guns that were simply 30" or 32" field guns with choke constrictions starting around .030 and up. I've shot a boatload of ducks and geese with 2 3/4" loads and most of those with a 20ga. My 30" Fox SW is a great duck gun. Ask me how I know.

So to answer the OP's query; The definition of a long range shotgun to me is any gun you can reliably and cleanly kill birds within 40yds. The majority of hunters have no business shooting at birds 50,60yds or further.

[todd allen]

To Daryl's point. I live in what was once a pretty reliable crow flyway, in a small agricultural community in So. NV.
Me and my hunting bud were mad scientists, when it came to shotgun ballistics. Being avid hunters, and competitive pigeon shooters, we more than demanded proof. We tested everything, both on paper, and on actual birds.
One day we decided to test some loads on long range migrating crows. With my friend Chuck checking crow altitudes with a laser rangefinder, I would make, or attempt to make stupid-high pass shots at the passing crows. Guns used: An Ithaca Mag 10, and a Perazzi Pigeon gun with 35k and 40k chokes. We couldn't afford to have the NASA Space Agency confirm our findings, but the 12 ga was killing crows out to what we concluded was the lethal limits of the shot size, independent of the added payload of the Mag 10.
The max of the no fly zone was about 90 yards straight up.

[mobirdhunter]

Long range guns are wasted on me. I'm a very poor long range shooter. I don't take long shots except for the occasional 45 yard dove (and usually miss). I'm not good at estimating the distance of birds, and generally overestimate them. My shooting averages are good because of this, but I know I'm a fair shot at best. What counts for me is not wounding birds, and taking shorter, makable shots is my method.

Having said this, I still like the idea of those big guns, have a few, and bring them out on occasion to stretch my arms out some. Still, I keep hoping to find a nice, big gun, like the HE or one of those 3 frame Parker 12s. I admire and respect a good long shot, one who practices and can do it with regularity. It's just not me.

I'm really enjoying this thread and have learned much from it. Thanks to the posters.

[Stan Hillis]

I absolutely love using big, heavy long range double guns, for ducks, doves and the occasional turkey hunt. My 12/32" HE Fox, factory chambered in 3" length, weighs in at 9/8, as I recall, unloaded. My 12/32" 3E Smith is also factory chambered at 3" length, but not nearly as heavy as the Fox. I much prefer the big Fox with heavy loads for waterfowl. I also have a 3" chambered A grade Fox, 12/32", with a straight grip. I don't like it nearly as well as the HE with heavy loads.

I'm not a muscled up strongman, but I could never understand the obsession with lightweight shotguns for hunting. I have never had any problem chasing down a speeding woodie, or dove, with the big HE. I really enjoy trying to kill doubles (2 for 2) on ducks. With the heavy bismuth loads I use I just don't like the way a lighter weight double gun "jumps around" in my hands from the recoil of the first shot. Weight attenuates that a great deal, as does a pistol grip for me, which allows me to get on that second bird much faster and more accurately.

JMO, YMMV