Restoration of Fine Sporting Arms

[mobirdhunter]

So sorry to see what happened to your gun. Also, I really appreciate your sharing the information with us, especially because I know it must be painful to recount. You've helped many avoid an equally bad situation.

[Rick Riddell]

How does this happen? I can understand the frame warping, but the screws and engraving, especially if thats your schtick and you advertise classes for it. I just cant wrap my head around it. You think someone who advertises fine sporting gun restorations would have at least called and replaced the screws and fixed up the engravings, better to have a warped action with all the pieces than a warped action with frozen buggered screws and missing pieces. Its a shame the way you were treated, I can understand things can happen when dealing with guns, but you are the customer and hopefully they make it right.

[Kensal Rise]

While I can certainly understand Mr. Graziano's frustration with his Parker's "restoration," there is something about this thread that makes me uneasy.

Perhaps it's that the "prosecution" has presented its case... but the defense has not.

What's more, there's an expectation that the two aggrieved parties attempt a private resolution as gentlemen before any public airing of issues. I don't see evidence of that yet.

There are two sides to every story. And I'd hate to see the PGCA Forum even partially descend into the vile mire of ego, incivility and negativism that another notable "BBS" has become.

[Bill Murphy]

Number one; I would recommend that the moderators not close this thread. Next, I would say that Mr. Roberts has said that Gillette admitted to some serious neglect on the handling of the receiver and maybe other parts. At this point, I would be retaining some legal assistance to recover damages from Gillette. I'm sure he has business insurance that covers such problems. It is up to him whether he feels he can continue his business after his admission that he is "not up to it". The total loss of a very nice VH 12 gauge shouldn't exceed $4500 or $5000 with expenses adding very little. Insurance or a private settlement should compensate the owner. End of story for everyone. No lies, no foul. If a refinisher is "not up to it", let him retire with his reputation intact.

[mobirdhunter]

Originally Posted by John Campbell

While I can certainly understand Mr. Graziano's frustration with his Parker's "restoration," there is something about this thread that makes me uneasy.

Perhaps it's that the "prosecution" has presented its case... but the defense has not.

What's more, there's an expectation that the two aggrieved parties attempt a private resolution as gentlemen before any public airing of issues. I don't see evidence of that yet.

There are two sides to every story. And I'd hate to see the PGCA Forum even partially descend into the vile mire of ego, incivility and negativism that another notable "BBS" has become.

This makes sense, and yes, I'm sure there is another perspective. Although it might be good to know what that is, I also feel like I'm a bystander to all of this and perhaps don't need to know (or should not know) all of the details.

I do think this: If we (as we have) asked to see the results of restoration work done by various smiths and these photos were shown to me, I would not consider sending my guns to that smith for work...whether I know the circumstances or not. As difficult as this matter is for our colleague, I still appreciate seeing the work done by various gunsmiths, no matter what the result. I can draw my own conclusions.

John, I'm glad you brought this up.

[PML]

Originally Posted by John Campbell

While I can certainly understand Mr. Graziano's frustration with his Parker's "restoration," there is something about this thread that makes me uneasy.

Perhaps it's that the "prosecution" has presented its case... but the defense has not.

What's more, there's an expectation that the two aggrieved parties attempt a private resolution as gentlemen before any public airing of issues. I don't see evidence of that yet.

There are two sides to every story. And I'd hate to see the PGCA Forum even partially descend into the vile mire of ego, incivility and negativism that another notable "BBS" has become.

Kensal,
The man did not prosecute anyone. He presented the work done and showed the results and gave his actual(photo) and anecdotal evidence of the facts based on his dealing with the men who performed the work. I very much appreciate the fact that he took the time to do this based on his business with people who restore the guns we all pursue. I guess if you lawyerly folks think there is a case to defend, then ok, defend it. From the evidence presented I think you might want to just plead it out as SHIT work and move on. Kensal, You certainly might be a witness for the defense as you like to "lightly restore" guns. Good luck, but I think you have a looser here.

Personally, I think this should be the next Parker of the month to remind people that we should shoot them and not try to make them young again. I feel bad for the owner but I think he should just hang it on the wall and the next time he wants to take a Parker and put lipstick (new case colors) on it he can have a reminder of what might happen.

Patrick Lien

[Kensal Rise]

Originally Posted by Patrick Lien

Kensal,
The man did not prosecute anyone. He presented the work done and showed the results and gave his actual(photo) and anecdotal evidence of the facts based on his dealing with the men who performed the work. I very much appreciate the fact that he took the time to do this based on his business with people who restore the guns we all pursue. I guess if you lawyerly folks think there is a case to defend, then ok, defend it. From the evidence presented I think you might want to just plead it out as SHIT work and move on. Kensal, You certainly might be a witness for the defense as you like to "lightly restore" guns. Good luck, but I think you have a looser here.

Personally, I think this should be the next Parker of the month to remind people that we should shoot them and not try to make them young again. I feel bad for the owner but I think he should just hang it on the wall and the next time he wants to take a Parker and put lipstick (new case colors) on it he can have a reminder of what might happen.

Patrick Lien

Mr. Lein:
I rest my case with regard in your "BBS Approach" to my observations. And respectfully refer you -- and the Forum Moderator -- to these points from "Forum Decorum":


No profanity will be tolerated.
Do NOT post sexual, racial, or other jokes or cartoons, and/or comments/illustrations that disparage others because they are different.

Do NOT post political discussions concerning Democrats, Republican, or other parties - or liberal versus conservative views/platforms. You may discuss gun rights but be careful not digress into a political debate. For example, encouraging others to vote or join the NRA are acceptable posts. Encouraging others to vote for a certain party or politician is political and not allowed.

Be polite and respectful to others. There are no stupid questions, there are however rude answers which might get the responder a “time out”.
Try to be helpful to others. If you are in a bad mood then please do not participate as your negative mood will undoubtedly show in your posts.
Do NOT drink alcohol and post in this forum. You know who you are – and so do we….

Common respectful and professional debates are encouraged BUT, that does NOT include a personal attack of the person you are debating. Frankly, if you do not like someone - do not fight or attack them in your posts. Please contact them outside this forum and our servers/systems – and then feel free to trade insults.



Have a Blessed Palm Sunday.

[Rick Riddell]

Originally Posted by John Campbell

Mr. Lein:
I rest my case with regard in your "BBS Approach" to my observations. And respectfully refer you -- and the Forum Moderator -- to these points from "Forum Decorum"

Have a Blessed Palm Sunday.

Last I will ever say it, and I'm done with this thread, but those in glass houses shouldnt throw stones, you werent the only one to frequent the BBS and as I recall you also broke a few windows until a few of yours got broken. Not a good idea to decry the actions of others that reflect your own. And with that have a blessed Palm Sunday!

[Opening Day]

Originally Posted by John Campbell

Mr. Lein:
I rest my case with regard in your "BBS Approach" to my observations. And respectfully refer you -- and the Forum Moderator -- to these points from "Forum Decorum":


No profanity will be tolerated.
Do NOT post sexual, racial, or other jokes or cartoons, and/or comments/illustrations that disparage others because they are different.

Do NOT post political discussions concerning Democrats, Republican, or other parties - or liberal versus conservative views/platforms. You may discuss gun rights but be careful not digress into a political debate. For example, encouraging others to vote or join the NRA are acceptable posts. Encouraging others to vote for a certain party or politician is political and not allowed.

Be polite and respectful to others. There are no stupid questions, there are however rude answers which might get the responder a “time out”.
Try to be helpful to others. If you are in a bad mood then please do not participate as your negative mood will undoubtedly show in your posts.
Do NOT drink alcohol and post in this forum. You know who you are – and so do we….

Common respectful and professional debates are encouraged BUT, that does NOT include a personal attack of the person you are debating. Frankly, if you do not like someone - do not fight or attack them in your posts. Please contact them outside this forum and our servers/systems – and then feel free to trade insults.



Have a Blessed Palm Sunday.

Sorry John,
This is one of those times we tend to disagree

[Craig Larter]

Some avoid top restoration artists because of expense. Makes top shops look cheap like Turnbull Restorations. Just my opinion. This case is hard for me to believe. Hard to believe anyone with a brain would even return such a train wreck to a customer and expect payment.