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01-29-2022, 02:09 PM | #13 | ||||||
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Time... or possibly a lack of interest in recording any gun below Grade 3...?
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"I'm a Setter man. Not because I think they're better than the other breeds, but because I'm a romantic - stuck on tradition - and to me, a Setter just "belongs" in the grouse picture." George King, "That's Ruff", 2010 - a timeless classic. |
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01-29-2022, 05:38 PM | #14 | ||||||
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That could be the case. Commander Gunther is no longer with us, nor is Charlie Price. Bill Mullins could give us his opinion.
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01-29-2022, 06:30 PM | #15 | ||||||
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From what I understand, and this is subject to correction, Cdr. Gunther spent the most time with transcribing and contracting keypunch personnel on what data went into the Serialization book. Is this correct? He is the one who made notations in red in the books he was examining.
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__________________
"I'm a Setter man. Not because I think they're better than the other breeds, but because I'm a romantic - stuck on tradition - and to me, a Setter just "belongs" in the grouse picture." George King, "That's Ruff", 2010 - a timeless classic. |
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01-30-2022, 03:17 AM | #16 | ||||||
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As I understand it, Commander Gunther copied the stock books single handed. I don't know about the red marks, never saw them. I was having lunch with Commander Gunther when he invited us to the parking lot at the Arms, and presented us with the stock book copies. No big discussion, just did it. What a guy.
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01-30-2022, 10:48 AM | #17 | ||||||
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I am not getting into the negotiations with the authors & the PGCA, that is a topic by itself. Bill is correct, in that Roy Gunther copied the STOCK books, basically, by himself, he also scanned the ORDER books for guns of a grade GREATER than D's and copied that info by hand; therefore, ignoring grades less than grade 3. A group of PGCA members obtained permission from then plant manager, Sam Renzey(sp) to enter Remington Arms in Ilion to copy the order books & IBM cards.
So, when the authors obtained permission from Remington to have the Parker Gun Identification & Serialization book published by Fjestad, the data base info that had been gathered by Gunther was used as a base for the publication. That is why the LOWER grade guns (that are in the Fjestad book) of less than grade 3, from the ORDER books are missing . I hope this finally answers the question !!!! Allan ially answers the question |
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Order Books |
01-30-2022, 04:19 PM | #18 | ||||||
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Order Books
What Bill and Allan said is correct. To add to that…
A bit of background…. When Cdr. Gunther copied the Order Books ( one at a time as Remington only allowed one book to be taken out of fear of being lost) he copied only grade 3 and above guns as the TPS authors assumed collectors were primarily interested in the higher grades. Parker did not record their guns by grade but by dollar amount. For example: D grade guns were $100 guns C grade guns were $150 guns B grade guns were $200 guns A grade guns were $300 guns AA grade guns were $400 guns A1 Special guns were $500 or above guns Occasionally when sales or the economy were slow Parker would lower the price of the guns to motivate potential buyers. For example a customer might be able to buy an A1S for $400. When Gunther went through the Order Books he always “assumed” for example a $400 gun was an AA gun and etc. The Order Books were kept only up to 1920. Thereafter gun records were maintained on IBM cards. These cards recorded the grade, serial number, gauge, date of manufacture and to whom shipped…. which usually was the wholesaler or retailer. As with the Stock and Order books several IBM cards were missing and or damaged beyond legibility. When the late Charlie Price built a data base he statistically accounted for the missing records and guns and added accordingly based upon the books that were available. Hope this helps and might clear up some confusion. Bill 🇺🇸 |
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Records |
01-30-2022, 04:28 PM | #19 | ||||||
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Records
PS…. Cdr. Gunther drove from Averill Park NY to Illion NY every day for one month to copy the records. He would copy all day and actually “burned” up one of Remington’s copy machines! They instructed him to bring his own copier in the future. Ron Kirby, then Executive Director of the PGCA had a son who sold copying machines and gracefully supplied one for the remaining coping necessary!
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01-30-2022, 04:44 PM | #20 | ||||||
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Bill
Thanks for the DETAILED data of the transaction, I did not want go into the details. I knew you would & thanks Allan |
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