Guns that you turned your nose to but have changed your mind

[J.B. Books]

Originally Posted by Stephen Hodges

The 20 Gauge Nitro Special that Brian referred to is my gun.

I want to hear the stories and details of all those woodcock, pheasants and grouse shot with that gun

[Mike of the Mountain]

I always had a soft spot for the Crescent Arms hammer doubles. Had a few of them and they all held up their end of the bargain. I also have a soft spot for the Stevens 311. That was my Pappy's favorite (and only) double gun and in 16g too. It took countless rabbits and pheasants on the farm. Still have it. Only thing I ever did was add a recoil pad to give it some length. Still a good, solid gamegetter.

[charlie cleveland]

nice gun....charlie

[Stan Hoover]

Just an observation,

From what I've seen in the past, the Lefevers produced by Ithaca were sent out with the butt plate with the opposing half circles )))))(((((.

The butt plate with the Ithaca Gun Co INC was for the NID's.

I did not read this, just what I've found. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Stan

[Researcher]

For most of the production life of the NID, they had a plain horizontally grooved butt plate. Here on a No. 5E --

435837 11.jpg

Here on a Field Grade --

Butt Plate, NID Field Grade 410-Bore.jpg

On the Lefever Nitro Specials they used the curved lines.

191014 04.jpg

Here on an A-Grade

301420 06.jpg

The butt plates with the horizontal grooves and the Ithaca Gun Co., Inc. at the bottom were primarily used on the Model 37s, but did appear on a few of the very last post WW-II NIDs --

Late Ithaca Butt Plates.JPG

Also on a few NIDs restocked by Ithaca in the 1950s and 60s. Note that 1946 vintage, high condition, Nitro Special Brian provided a link to, 356035, has this butt plate.

[Joe from MO]

Originally Posted by Dave Noreen

Also on a few NIDs restocked by Ithaca in the 1950s and 60s. Note that 1946 vintage, high condition, Nitro Special Brian provided a link to, 356035, has this butt plate.

My son's nitro has the horizontal lines Buttplate. It's a 1946 or 47 gun. I need to go look that up....

Just checked, his is a 1946 gun....356614

[Researcher]

That is a great looking Type 3 Nitro Special. I was thinking the Type 3s were using up left over A-Grade frames, but lately I've noticed they use the same type forearm and cocking cams as the earlier Nitro Specials. The A-Grades use the same cocking cams and forearms with the J-spring latch as the 1935 and later Ithaca NIDs. A 20-gauge Lefever A-Grade above and a 28-gauge Ithaca NID below --

300713 08.JPG

[charlie cleveland]

I have a stevens 410 double 3 inch gun you never have to worry about what shell to shoot in it...come to think of it I have never heard of any body saying any thing about what shell to shoot in a 410 except maybe the chamber length 2 inch versus 2 1/2 and 3 inch....I looked on my oldest shell boxes 410 they say just watch chamber length...nothing mentioned about barrel steel...I wonder aout this because a 410 has some mighty high chamber questions...I thought maybe I had seen some composite barrel 410 s but I may be remembering wrong....does anybody out there have a Damascus or wire twist 410......charlie

[Researcher]

I thought maybe I had seen some composite barrel 410 s but I may be remembering wrong....does anybody out there have a Damascus or wire twist 410......charlie

The .410-bore shells were first introduced by our North American ammunition companies in the 1914-15 time frame. Apparently Remington Arms - Union Metallic Cartridge Co. being the first out with them, according to Encyclopedia of The 410 Shotshell in America 1914 - 1942, by Greg Bickford. Apparently their first .410-bore shells were produced at their factory in Windsor, Ontario, Canada. From the 1915-16 Rem-UMC catalog --

1915-16 Catalog Small Gauge Loaded Shells.jpeg

J. Stevens Arms & Tool Co. claimed their No. 106/108 single as the first .410-bore gun in North America.

Catalog No. 54, No. 106 & 108.jpeg

However, just to muddy the waters, the 1910 Harrington & Richardson catalog offers their Model 1905 for the .410 Eley --

H&R 1910 Catalog Model 1905.jpg

For a couple of decades prior, out mail order houses, importers and our manufacturers of small single barrels offered guns for the .44-40 shot and .44XL --

.44 shot cartridges.jpg

Little Ladies .44 Caliber Shotgun 1902.jpg

Imported little guns 1912 SD&G Catalogue.jpg

Many of these imported JABCs (Just Another Belgian Clunkers) had twist barrels. Many of the .44XL guns have been bored out to take .410-bore shells. If they have .44" bores like my H & R Model 1905 --

Model 1905 02.JPG

Model 1905 03.JPG

they couldn't have had much of a gas seal with the old fiber wads.

[charlie cleveland]

i quit looking to soon i did find a box of 410 shells that had the warning to not shoot them in wire twist or Damascus barrels...the box that had the warning on it was a peters box with the flying duck on it 2 1/2 inch shell box...the outher boxes i looked at were as old and older than the box the warning was on....i have no wire twist barreled 410 so i guess i m safe.....charlie