My 1901 16 gauge Parker

[D. Shane Burton]

Hey guys, I just wanted to post some info and pics of my two Parkers, so I can get some feedback about them and also figure out possible value. Anyone have an idea on condition?

Parker Brothers 16 gauge, frame size 0, weight = 3 with a 2 superscript, and Kf mark. Both barrel chambers measure 0.750in. The depth to the powder ring in the chambers is 2 1/2in. The choke on the right barrel is 0.650 horizontal and 0.657 vertical (not perfectly round). The choke on the left barrel is 0.655 horizontal, 0.655 vertical. Chokes are ??? Barrel lengths are 24in.

It has the plain buttplate with horizontal lines over most of it. It does NOT have a shield on the lower stock. Its serial number is 105322, dating it 1901. It also has what looks like a 105? on the base of the trigger guard.

I'll let the following pictures speak for themselves. On the pictures with both guns, it's the lower gun:

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[D. Shane Burton]

According to this page: http://www.parkerguns.org/pages/faq/ChokeSize.htm it would seem I have improved cylinder choke diameters on both barrels, though I have a feeling the barrels may have been cut down. How can this be? My 12 gauge, in another thread, had measurements that it is Cylinder and it was originally listed as being 30in, but the barrels are now 24 5/8in, so I know they're cut-down.

Any opinions?

Shane

[Dean Romig]

Well Shane, from your pictures it looks like both guns have been "rode hard" to the point of having been abused. The sixteen certainly looks to be in better condition than the twelve. In fact, I wouldn't even attempt to shoot the twelve at all. The barrels are in poor shape and the ribs are obviously seperating.
The stock on the sixteen presents a couple of questions - one being the Trojan buttplate... another being the lack of a shield in the stock where a grade 1 would have had one.... third being the capped pistol grip if it is a Trojan stock but it doesn't have Trojan checkering.... and finally, if it is a replacement stock, to my mind it is a Parker Bros. stock... very interesting. The serial number 105322 is not in the book so we don't know the original barrel length but it appears to have cut barrels too. Probably down from 26" judging by your choke measurements.

[D. Shane Burton]

I don't have the guns with me as I write this, but do you think the 12 and 16 buttplates could be switched? The guns have been together forever.

About the barrel length--I wonder why someone would only cut two inches off? I'm assuming the sighting bead would have to be removed and the mid-rib drilled and tapped to relocate it? I've seen other pictures of guns that look about the same in albums on here, but they never mention that the barrels have been cut down. I would think these should be cylinder bore if they're cut down, but the one that is perfectly round matches the chart for Improved Cylinder--how is this possible? Sorry, I'm new at this.

Thanks for the feedback. It's greatly appreciated.

Shane

[D. Shane Burton]

First off, thanks, Bruce.

Now back to something Dean posted:

Originally Posted by Dean Romig

Well Shane, from your pictures it looks like both guns have been "rode hard" to the point of having been abused. The sixteen certainly looks to be in better condition than the twelve. In fact, I wouldn't even attempt to shoot the twelve at all. The barrels are in poor shape and the ribs are obviously seperating.
The stock on the sixteen presents a couple of questions - one being the Trojan buttplate... another being the lack of a shield in the stock where a grade 1 would have had one.... third being the capped pistol grip if it is a Trojan stock but it doesn't have Trojan checkering.... and finally, if it is a replacement stock, to my mind it is a Parker Bros. stock... very interesting. The serial number 105322 is not in the book so we don't know the original barrel length but it appears to have cut barrels too. Probably down from 26" judging by your choke measurements.

Dean concerning the stock issues, since I'm not familiar with them, did any of the Trojan stocks issued have the capped pistol grip and lack of shield? I'm thinking the original stock may have been completely replaced with a Trojan stock at some point.

I know they'll never be great examples, but I'm hoping the 16 ga can be restored to be a shooter again.

Thanks for any insights,
Shane

[Bill Murphy]

Maybe if you tell us how much you paid, and maybe to whom, we could tell you if you got hurt, and if so, how badly.

[Bruce Day]

There is a whole section on cut barrels in the Parker FAQ section on the home page.

Every barrel that I have seen with out of round muzzle ends patterned poorly.

When a person buys an old double shotgun, they are essentially buying barrels.

[D. Shane Burton]

So, basically I got taken for a ride and both the guns are junk now?

Thanks for the choke explanation.

Shane

[Dean Romig]

Far and away the most common reason for cutting barrels was, for the uninformed of the day, a quick and cheap way of "opening" the chokes. Parker chokes were cut about 4" long - some even as much as 6" so by cutting 2" off the barrels the choke would have lost about 1/2 of its taper.

[Dean Romig]

We all sincerely hope you didn't pay a lot.