Top Secret Covert Black Ops

[Tom Brown]

What vol/issue of the DGJ was the article on psi for damascus, possibly where a shell was lodged in the bbl. and another one fired behind it to proove the strength? Thanks in advance, T.

[Drew Hause]

All of these are "required reading" Tom

The Double Gun & Single Shot Journal "Finding Out For Myself" by Sherman Bell Vol 17: Issue 3 (Autumn 2006) p. 12, Vol 17: Issue 4 (Winter 2006) p. 28, and Vol 20: Issue 3 (Autumn 2009) p. 108

And BTW
Experts on Guns and Shooting George Teasdale Teasdale-Buckell 1900
http://books.google.com/books?id=4xRmHkr7Lp8C
On the subject of steel v. Damascus, Mr Stephen Grant is very clear, and much prefers Damascus for hard working guns. He related an anecdote of one of his patrons, whose keeper stupidly put a 12-bore cartridge into his master’s gun without knowing that he had previously inserted a 20-case, which had stuffed up the barrel. Fortunately, no burst occurred, but a big bulge, which, however, Mr Grant hammered down, and the gun is now as good as ever.

[Bruce Day]

[QUOTE
On the subject of steel v. Damascus, Mr Stephen Grant is very clear, and much prefers Damascus for hard working guns. He related an anecdote of one of his patrons, whose keeper stupidly put a 12-bore cartridge into his master’s gun without knowing that he had previously inserted a 20-case, which had stuffed up the barrel. Fortunately, no burst occurred, but a big bulge, which, however, Mr Grant hammered down, and the gun is now as good as ever.[/QUOTE]


Response:

Beretta 687 20ga with 28ga shell dropped into tube and then loaded with a 20ga shell. Happened in August 2010 in Georgia to the brother of a friend.

We have had quite a few inquiries about these DGJ articles over the last ten years about the strength of damascus barrels. I knew we have published detailed lists several times. A person could probably pick them up in the archives.

[Harry Collins]

I am not where I can grab my DGJ. There is another series of articles Nito for Black Powder by John Brindle. These wernin the first several years of DGJ.
Harry

[Mike Murphy]

Drew, Glad you were able to remember the Volumes and Issues of the DGJ articles. I remember being stunned by the strength shown by Damascus in his torture tests.

I'm still trying to get over why Jerry jumped up and down on his Bamboo and Graphite Fly Rods!

[Jerry Andrews]

OK, I'll have to tell the quick story about that jumping on the rods!
I was fishing a little out of the way stream, walked in about 4 miles on railroad tracks, starts to rain, here comes a guy walking back out. Pretty well dressed gent, looked like he just robbed the Orvis store. We stopped to chat for a second, he asked me if I wanted to have a bad day back in here fishing with a primitive tool like I had. I tried to talk to him about the beauty and advantages of bamboo, but he insisted it was a piece of worthless junk and proceeded to tell me as much. Said they broke when you looked at them. That's when I asked him to lay his graphite rod down on the rails and let me jump on it and he could do the same to my cane rod. He asked what the hell was wrong with me, I told him if the rod was so fragile then let's jump on each other's rods. He didn't go for it and that was that. He sulked away, the same bitter person I'd met 10 minutes earlier, just a bit humiliated. I regret doing it. I should have simply smiled and been polite and not gotten so redaxxed over the event. Some say I have a temper, I don't believe it!
PS. I bought a dandy Eagle grade Smith with the incorrect forend metal. Does anyone have good pics of an Eagle engraving on the forend metal you could send me? Thanks much, & sorry for the lengthy story.
One more PS. I think John Gierach, the Trout Bum had a similar condescending thing happen in a book of his.

Jerry- I have that great book, about 20 some years ago after a TU group trip to fish the Bow in Alberta, my best fly fishing buddy and ace seven card stud player gave me a copy. I'll look it up.

One thing they don't seem to teach in the Orvis and other fly fishing schools is good streamside manners- I gave up steelheading on the PM (Michigan- Baldwin area) some years ago for two reasons: (1) My old friend and mentor Merle T. Nolph had passed away- before that I always parked at his home, near Doc Green's bend and just about where the Baldwin Creek connects to the main branch- "Simmy" got me a permit pass so I could be on the PM R&G Club properties w/o facing a trespassing charge- (2) The Johnson's Orvis Lodge upriver- their guides were A-OK-, but some of their clients acted like they owned the river for the day, as they were paying for the guide fee-

I don't see where you were "off base" as the other gent made comments about your fly rod, etc first- But you are right, in retrospect- it might have been better to have walked away, shaking your head in wonder- As a long-time Leonard man, I know the cross section (like a guided bend test for API- and ASTM code welding) of a six-sided bamboo rod will stand more "gaff" than any hollowed out "soda straw" synthetic fly rod.

What gets me is all the high prices and hype for these graphite rods- and the distance casting claims- "Casting ain't Catching"--

[Bruce Day]

Jerry was found on the stream thusly:

And I was found so:

[Bruce Day]

Francis, did you ever meet John Voelker ( Robert Travers) up in the UP? If so, that had to be a treat. Great stories. My grandfather used to fish for steelhead up there with a 9ft Heddon Thorobred, which I own today along with his Parker. Always wanted to go fishing up there. I talked to Bob Summers once and he told me about the boats and guides dragging heavily weighted streamers and roe sacks along the bottom as they drifted....he didn't consider that flyfishing and certainly not suitable for his rods. I have a Goodwin Granger Favorite model steelhead rod and hope to get up there sometime.

John Voelker, son of Irish-German brewer and tavern owner Nick Voelker- his mother's maiden name was Traver- so that's the "nom de plume"- but never got to drink whiskey sours and fly fish at his "Frenchman's Pond" retreat. He came down (someone held a gun to his head the rumor has it) from his beloved U.P. and was guest speaker at a TU Banquet- I got to chat with him briefly- when I mentioned I had owned a Morris Kushner "Excelreme" dry fly rod once, he light right up- I have several of his lesser known books as well as Trout Madness-- Danny and the Boys and the book detailing his start in the legal profession as a P.A. with Judge Belden in the 1940's-quite a writer, even before Anatomy of a Murder--

I also met Bernard "Lefty" Kreh, Mel Kreiger and even Ernie Schweibert, all from being a TU member back then- all these gentlemen anglers are gone now-

IMO- the best story John Voelker wrote about fishing and his hard fisted harder headed father Nick was featured years ago in an early Gray's Sporting Journal- 1977-78 maybe-- "Fishermen at Night"-- I still use his father Nick's term for a double shot- a "Doubler" was what he called a two of anything apparently- even a double header in baseball. Believe my favorite story of all, "The Measure of Silent Spirits" by Art Lee also was featured in that issue- both are great reads and I highly recommend them.

Heddon rods were made in MI- Dowagiac and Heddon, like Granger- (both Goodwin and later W&M- and even Phillipson as well) all had various grades, the main differences were cosmetic- the wraps, blued ferrules, reel seats, bags and tubes--I still have a 8 foot 3/2 W&M Granger Aristocrat 5 wt- also a pre-fire Leonard 7 & 1/2 foot 3/2 49 4/5 wt. I am keeping- I love the Leonards, but the comparable Grangers and Heddons were their equals in casting, function and fish fighting abilities. I have never owned a bamboo steelhead or salmon rod however.

I have known Bob Summers, as most all MI fly fishermen seem to-his rods are equal to the great Paul Young rods, but Bob apprenticed at the Young Rod Co. in Detroit. Lyle Dickerson rods, from Bellaire area of MI (near Bob's location on the Boardman, South of TC- are also "Steinways" but like the Paynes, Gillums and Garrison sticks, you'll write a big check to get an original one of those=- and the Parker Loman Hawes--wow, so few made over such a short time frame, and made when only bamboo was used for fly rods, whether a South bend or a Garrison-- I wish you the best of luck in your search my friend.