Old Ammo

[Dean Romig]

Very informative Mark - thanks.

[C.O.B.]

Mark-Thank you very much for the information. A person could make quite a hobby out of studying these old shells. I buy them for decoration for the "Gun Room" and just happened to notice the unusual (to me) length of 2 7/8. Were early 28's chambered for this longer length or were they used in std 2 3/4 chambers?

[Roundsworth]

TheModel (19)12 was not made in 28 gauge in 1914 or 1928. It is an option in 1941 for the Model 12 and 37, but not the 21 (not even custom!) According to Madis, the 28 gauge was added to the Model 12 line-up in 1934 and dropped in 1958. The Model 21 was chambered for the 28 in 1936. Nothing about chamber lengths. There seems to be a lot of differences between Mr. Madis' book and actual catalogs. I guess a person had to inquire with the factory to make sure. As for Western, they bought WRA Co. in 1931. Boxes were not marked as such until 1939. Olin came into the picture in 1944. Boxes were marked 'Olin' in 1946. I have lotsa good Winchester info! Cheers!

[Roundsworth]

Here is a photo for your enjoyment!
Left to Right: 50x3-1/4", 4 gauge NPE, 10 gauge, 12 gauge, 16 gauge, 28 gauge (2-7/8")

Hmmmm...as for Madis, that is a challenge!

[charlie cleveland]

nice looking shells what brand of shell is the 4 ga. were is the 8 ga and 3 ga at. just a thought charlie

[C.O.B.]

I have Riffles book on the M12 but not the Middas book. One of the guns I wish I had back was a M12 28ga grade 5 skeet with a solid rib. I also had a matching M42. Some are kept some are tarded and some will always be missed...those two are missed I trade a Win 101 Pigeon grade 3 bbl set (20,28,410) for the M12 and M42 but can't remember for the life of me what those were traded for...probably a Parker.

[Roundsworth]

The photo is old. I do have a fairly complete line-up now. The 4 is a WRA Co. (I have a loaded Eley). The 10 and 16 are black powder WRA Co. The 12 is a WRA Co. Leader. The 28 is WRA Co. I am awaiting a larger-than-4 bore NPE. When that gets here, I will have a photo with it, 4, 8, 10, 10A, 12, 14, 16, 20, 28 and 32. The weekend of Puglisi's event, my youngest daughter and I will be in Minneapolis to see Ringo and His All Starr Band. Cheers!

[Researcher]

When the 28-gauge was first introduced in North America in the Parker Bros. doubles and the Remington Arms Co. singles, the "standard" load was 1 3/4 drams equiv. and 5/8 ounces of shot in a 2 1/2 inch case. However, virtually from the get go, the longer 2 7/8 inch 28-gauge case was available from the ammo companies. But just like the longer shells in larger gauges, back prior to WW-I, the longer shells only got more and better wadding from the ammo factories, not a heavier payload. In his 1910 book The American Shotgun, Chas. Askins, the elder, writes of handloading 3/4 ounce loads in 2 7/8 inch cases for his 6 3/4 pound, 30-inch barrel Parker Bros. 28-gauge. The 2 1/2 inch 5/8 ounce load remained the "standard" 28-gauge load until 1932 when Western Cartridge Co. brought out their Super-X 28-gauge in the 2 7/8 inch case with a 3/4 ounce load and a max charge of progressive burning powder. The other ammo companies soon followed suit. The introduction of this more powerful 28-gauge shell caused Ithaca Gun Co. to begin cataloging 28-gauge NID doubles again. Ithaca had quit cataloging 28-gauge doubles with the introduction of the NID in 1926, and its availability in .410-bore. They did make NID 28-gauge guns between 1926 and 32, but they were not catalogue items.

The Winchester Model 12 wasn't introduced in 28-gauge until 1937, and it was introduced chambered for 2 7/8 inch shells. Shortly after WW-II the ammo companies standardized the 28-gauge shells at 2 3/4 inch and later 28-gauge Model 12s were chambered for 2 3/4 inch shells. Since then various ammo companies have been stuffing 7/8 and even a full ounce in 2 3/4 inch 28-gauge shells!

Our good buddies at RST are making delightful little 2 1/2 inch 28-gauge shells again.

[Dean Romig]

Originally Posted by Dave Noreen

Our good buddies at RST are making delightful little 2 1/2 inch 28-gauge shells again.

I'm in complete agreement with that statement Dave - I've bought several flats of their 28 ga. loads and love 'em.

Great post - thanks Dave.