Is a greyed frame considered case colors?

[King Cobb]

I have looked through the past threads on here and even the archives and have found really only one discussion of this topic and that was I think way back in 2012.

The question is, is a greyed patina frame considered case colors? Is it desireable over a silver frame? Is it considered original?

I know in the other conversation-it came up as they were discussing how to consider % of case colors. Dean at the time considered a grey frame to be case colors and Bill Murphy had the opposing view at that time.

This is mostly just about my curiosity and trying to start what I think could be an interesting and educational discussion.

In addition, would you ever consider recasing a gun with a grey frame? The argument could be made that no gun left Meriden with a grey frame so it isn't original.....(trust me I have been in enough conversations on originality of tractors, cars, and other accoutrements over the years to know someone would make that argument).

Also, many complain about shiny nice case colors on a gun that is old and aged...Well, what if the rest of the gun was well preserved with pristine barrels and very nice original finish on the wood and good checkering, is the grey patina a clash with the quality of the rest of the gun?

Just asking and trying to start some discussion:

Personally, at this time, I like the grey/gun metal patina on a frame. It would be nice to have original case colors, my 2 barrel set DH actually has some blue and yellow colors remaining on the metal, but it would also be nice to own a high condition BHE but there you have it

Looking forward to the responses.

Example of a greyed frame





One with remaining faded case colors



And because we all like eye candy, here is one of the Parker's Mr. Day has shared in the past showing what aged/preserved original case colors look like today:

[OH Osthaus]

IMHO

Case is case. Faded / protected areas / or bright

Grey is grey

Some times, you can have a frame with some of both

I do not see any case in the first picture (although pictures can be deceiving)

Varying degrees in the others


One thing that is a given is remaining case is subjective

[King Cobb]

No the first two "grey" pics do not show traditional case. In the discussion in 2012, which you may have posted in Rick, the argument was made that the grey patina was case but faded or aged. Thanks for the input.

[Opening Day]

In the picture one and two I see faded case colors faded to gray, on picture three I see case colors on that receiver. Picture four not sure if picture was doctored or what but something is wrong on that pic. Just my opinion

[King Cobb]

Bruce says its original and no one else questioned it when he originally posted it.

I take him at his word about it.

you can see the original post here.

http://parkerguns.org/forums/showthread.php?t=1441

[Wild Skies]

The definition of a greyed frame to me is one that has lost all of its case colors. It is case-hardened, but no longer has any case colors.

[B. Dudley]

Colors are a byproduct of the hardening process. The hardness is not compromised if the colors are removed either naturally or intentionally.
The only way to effect the hardness is by annealing.

There is really no functional reason to re-case harden a frame.

[King Cobb]

Originally Posted by Brian Dudley

Colors are a byproduct of the hardening process. The hardness is not compromised if the colors are removed either naturally or intentionally.
The only way to effect the hardness is by annealing.

There is really no functional reason to re-case harden a frame.

I was just curious about people's preferences. Along the same lines there is no functional reason to rebrown a set of damascus barrels is there?

[Harold Pickens]

I actually like the gray patina look after the case colors have worn off. I would refinish fluid or Damascus barrels, refinish the stock, but would not re-case color a gun.

[Kirk Potter]

Originally Posted by Harold Lee Pickens

I actually like the gray patina look after the case colors have worn off. I would refinish fluid or Damascus barrels, refinish the stock, but would not re-case color a gun.

I feel the same way usually although I guess it depends what condition and how original the gun is. I decided to have the receiver on my Reproduction redone only because I had so little $$$ into it anyways, and I don't see it hurting any collector value. But yeah, I like the look of the gray patina as well.