Original vs TLC

C.O.B. · 02-06-2014, 09:16 AM

Mark Callanan's thread on value of original vs restored has brought up a lot of good points that I'd like to explore further so therefor a new thread so as not to hijack his any further.

The English have sent their guns back to the respective maker after the season for ever with no real determint to value to have them freshened up. This might mean the barrels get reblacked, the stock refinished, case color redone etc. This process has always had a negative effect on American guns be it a Parker or a Winchester M70 etc.

My question is what is the opinion here of haveing a little TLC done to a 100+ year old Parker going to do to its value?

My case in point is a CHE damascuss 20ga. IMHO the barrels could use the expertise of Dale Edmonds/Brad Batchelder and the Silvers pad is flat as a pancake. To replace the pad isn't a big concern as I would retain the original pad with the gun. Once the barrels are done the "originality" is lost forever. This is one of the more rare guns I have as according to TPS only 8 were made with 26 inch bbls and th gun is exactly as the PGCA letter depics.

I have been told not to touch this as "where are you going to find a 100% original gun like this one?"

Opinions please

jsd245 · 02-06-2014, 09:52 AM

i think the approach you take is what you intend to do with the gun. If your only concern is collector value and resale it seems obvious that refinishing seems to hurt the value. For me- every gun I own I will shoot, so buying a gun in need of refinishing, or refinishing a gun that has had several years of use and needs freshening up is no problem for me. If I spend more than the gun is worth I will. I spent a great deal of time in my life hunting with beater guns. I don't need to any more. I like the signature one of the members here has- something like don't hunt with a gun that will embarrass your dog.

If I was looking for a gun, and I was looking at a gun in original 70% condition, or a gun that had been restored "as new" and done well I pick the restored one every time. My heirs can worry about the resale value. So in your gun's case- if you were going to sell it to me a new pad and refinished barrels would increase my interest.

I guess that's pretty much the answer that's been given before- value is only dependent on the buyers and seller expectations, so restored or original you just need to find the buyer that wants what you've got.

A guy I used to know had a funny little saying when it came to selling stuff. He'd say that there an A$$ for every seat.

C.O.B. · 02-06-2014, 10:07 AM

I hunt with it ( I haven't gotten anything with it yet and it's turning out to be an unlucky gun in the Grouse coverts

) but someday I'll sell it and hopefully turn a profit. I don't have anything I don't use.

C grade · 02-06-2014, 10:22 AM

Rich
If you do the barrels you will lose value but if you gain enough enjoyment from the "new" barrels it may be worth it. Recase coloring a gun is a major loss of value, barrels less so. That is a rare gun and if it was me, I would just enjoy it as is and not create one less special Parker. A girl is only a virgin once.
David

jsd245 · 02-06-2014, 10:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich Anderson

I hunt with it ( I haven't gotten anything with it yet and it's turning out to be an unlucky gun in the Grouse coverts

) but someday I'll sell it and hopefully turn a profit. I don't have anything I don't use.

Well then I guess that's part of the answer. If its a gun you're carrying in the grouse coverts, each year that goes by, you'll wear off a little more case color, a little more blue off the barrels, you'll get a few more dings and scratches on the stock. Let's face it- every time you bring it in the woods, particularly if the covers you hunt are like the ones I do, there is a relatively good chance some damage could happen to the gun. I fall at least once every season, and each time that I do my main concern is injury to myself or anyone around me. I'm not concerned about breaking the stock on the gun or denting the barrel. If something is going to get sacrificed it will be the gun. You seem to want to refinish it, otherwise you wouldn't be considering it. Resale obviously is not your only concern, otherwise you would put it in the safe and leave it there. You seem to want to enjoy the gun, so do what makes you enjoy it more.

Dean Romig · 02-06-2014, 10:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeff Davis

A guy I used to know had a funny little saying when it came to selling stuff. He'd say that there an A$$ for every seat.

That's what we say in the automobile business and its truth rings as soundly as a bell.

Dean Romig · 02-06-2014, 10:49 AM

Each gun must be assessed on its own. A hard and fast rule can't be applied across the board to all Parkers. Common, low grade guns with no special features and no documented provenance to a shooter of note, that are in poor cosmetic condition, can only be improved by refinishing or a complete restoration. That is the owner's choice. But don't expect to recover your expenses at the time of sale - you'll break even at best.
On the other hand, a rare, scarce, specially optioned, or unique Parker requires a lot more consideration. What do you intend to accomplish by refinishing such a gun? Refinishing or a full restoration of such guns might just damage the intrinsic value of such a gun that has a patina that bespeaks the loving use and care of the gun by the original owner.... why would anyone want to eradicate that on such a gun?
Some such guns however, can benefit from the expert's hand in enhancing the appearance of a worn-out or abused (by subsequent owners) gun that otherwise, might be placed on the "project gun" pile. These "experts" are infinitely few (I'll keep my opinions to myself on who) and just who you send your gun to will require a great deal of homework and examination of their work with a very keen eye.

"To each his own." and I firmly believe in this but remember, original, unmessed-with Parkers are becoming fewer and fewer and many of them need to remain in original condition.

I had this one "freshened up" a bit by someone I and many others consider to be an expert. He refinished the wood and nicely recheckered it, and cleaned the rest of it but didn't refinish the barrels or the other metal parts. It doesn't look newly refinished and I didn't want it to. I wanted most of the original owner's evidence of use and care to still be evident.... to me it makes the gun still more "Admiral Thomas Perry's" than mine... I'm just the intermediary custodian of the gun for now.

.

Pay Dirt · 02-06-2014, 11:34 AM

It seems to me that the same contingent of "Collectors" who opine that it is sacrilege to refinish a rare or scarce gun might be the same group who would have no interest in buying that gun in its' original glory due to its' lack of condition.

How distressed is distressed enough to warrant a restoration?

Dean Romig · 02-06-2014, 11:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobby Cash

It seems to me that the same contingent of "Collectors" who opine that it is sacrilege to refinish a rare or scarce gun might be the same group who would have no interest in buying that gun in its' original glory due to its' lack of condition.

How distressed is distressed enough to warrant a restoration?

In answer to your question, again, "To each his own."

I bought Adm. Perry's gun, fully knowing its provenance, in rough condition, for quite a tidy sum

with the full intention of someday making it nice again.

Snap Cap · 02-06-2014, 11:53 AM

Rich, the easy answer is to pick up another set of 20 guage damascus 0 frame barrels and have them pimped up and fitted. A rotted bore set would work since these would be just used for shooting, add sleeve and choke tubes. You already have the solution to the pad issue solved. Mount the new one, don't cut the wood and keep the old one for resale. Let me know if you run across a set of tired 16 gauge 0 frame Dam while looking for the 20s, I have a similar project ongoing....