Provenance

[Austin W Hogan]

I will be at the pre view at Julia's Sunday afternoon, and at the auction Monday. I hope to see a few of you there and maybe have a lobster together.

I think this may be a landmark event in sporting arms collecting. It seems that "factory originality" has trumped association with a distinguished shooter or owner with respect to the collectability of sporting arms. There are two notable Parker exceptions. The Czar gun, and "Burt's gun" sold for approximatly 6 times the amount they would have brought as wood and iron, without a story. The provenance of the Czar gun was near impeccable; a number of entries in the order books, a letter from Mr Parker, the original hang tags, and single family ownership far outweighed a new stock. Burt's Gun provenance is even better; Burt handed it to young Bill Tappley who hunted it and wrote of it for 60 years, before passing it on just before his death. There is some pretty good observational support for the provenance of collectability of these two guns; every one of Julia's telephone bidder's representatives was on their feet when the Czar gun lot was called; and I was able to count nine individual bidders chasing Burt's gun at the Cobbs.

It is currently assessed that Nash Buckingham's association with a Super Fox will cause that gun to be sold at 10 to 20 times the amount it would bring without the association. I will judge its provenance and collectability from the number of bidders on the phone, and the number in the gallery fidgeting with bidders cards when the lot is called.

Parker Pages would do an article, or series, on Provenance if sufficient inputs are recieved . We would really like to be able to assess current feelings on provenance of sporting arms and Parkers in particular.

You can post your thoughts here, or e mail them to me at

austin.w.hogan@valley.net

Thanks, Austin

[Dean Romig]

As with the Czar's Parker and with Burt's Gun there is an enormous amount of trepidation - a tingling you can actually feel - a sincere skepticism balanced by a firm desire for it all to be true, to be the "real deal" the undeniable original "Bo-Whoop", the magic wand of the legendary but flesh and blood hero iconic American waterfowler Nash Buckingham.

Some will courageously levy their maximum bids while others, cowed by insecurity and the lack of hard evidence beyond that which is known and printed in the Julia's catalog will sweat and tremble and in the end only wish they had placed that bid - that winning bid...

[Austin W Hogan]

Thanks Dean; you are correct in the observation. But this is really the same as a newly discovered work of a well known artist coming up for sale; what information convinces you that it is genuine? Or, what in the painting makes it more desirable than other work of the same artist?

Best, Austin

[dave s]

I have good information about how a guy from back east who contacteda certain Tony. to make a copy of the Czar's parker back in the1980's Tony required a deposit of $90,000. When the gun was finished the buyer decided he wanted his money back and not the shotgun. This all ended up in court where the judge decided that "This case sounds like two crooks were out to screw each other" so neither person was favored in the decisison. So folks; I don't believe that this so called recently sold czar's parker has any real merit, especially with a fake being out there. My info from a member of the Ye old conn. gun guild and the american society. I am just relating a factual story to remind all of us that there are lots of money to be made in in faking guns as well as documentation.

[Bill Murphy]

In my opinion, Tony's "Not the Czar's Parker" will sell for more than the Czar's Parker next time it goes on the block.

[Chuck Heald]

My vague understanding of provenance is that continuity of documented possession and transfer is key for an item that cannot otherwise be irrefuteably validated.

[MarketHunter]

Anybody who pays big bucks for that Buckingham gun with the shakey provenance needs their head examined, but somebody will.......

DLH

[Opening Day]

Originally Posted by Destry L. Hoffard

Anybody who pays big bucks for that Buckingham gun with the shakey provenance needs their head examined, but somebody will.......

DLH

I agree with Destry, it has shakey provenance and just how long will Julia guarantee that it is the real deal after the sale..... as I know from bitter experience What I was out was nothing (5 K ) compared to what this buyer maybe out You think Julia will cover the cost of the gun six months from now if or when it turns out not to be the real deal or some insurance company comes to claim it..... I would want something in writing from Julia's, a guarantee in writing with a moneyback return for at least a year and that I can "Guarantee" Julia will not give. Sorry I have little trust.

[MarketHunter]

Eric,

If I was you, every gunshow or shooting event I attended, I'd put that gun on my table with a big sign giving all the details. My guess is it wouldn't take long for "Mr. Julia" to get back in touch with you saying he'd changed his mind.


DLH

[Robert Rzepiela]

A year ... ? If I am paying 100K for this gun, I want like 20 years guarantee !!