Fishtail Lever Survey
 

Maybe this is the right time to ask those with a fishtail lever hammer gun that won't open with the right hammer cocked...

WHAT FRAME SIZE IS YOUR GUN?




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I checked my frame size and this gun is a 2 frame. The fishtail mates perfectly with the hammer profile. I played around with it and it does open with the hammer cocked but I have to tap the top of the bbls with my off hand for the bbls to pivot. I will give it a real good lube and see if that does the trick.

No fishtail here, I keep wishing:rolleyes:

7 frame 8 gauge and 6 frame 10 gauge will not open with right hammer cocked. 0 frame 20 gauge does open.

I have two hammer guns with fishtail top levers. A O frame 16 and a 1 frame 12.
The O frame 16 will open intermittently with the right hammer cocked, it is very close.
The 1 frame 12 always opens with the hammer cocked.

Dont want to derail the survey but is it possible wear or attempts to tighten the wear have changed function despite original intent?

I would suspect that there would have been enough clearance originally been built in to the gun originally produced with the fishtail lever to have accomodated this possibility.





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16 ga 0 frame Fishtail will not open with right hammer cocked
12 ga Grade 2 1 1/2 frame straight lever will open

My 6 frame fishtail 8ga O grade will not open with the right trigger cocked.

12 ga, Grade 1, 1-frame, fishtail lever, always opens with right hammer cocked

My 1888, 12 gauge, 1-frame, grade 2, fishtail hammer gun opens every time with the hammer cocked or not.

Not to hijack the original intent of this thread, but since it has the attention of Fish Tail folks; Do any of you, have, had, or know of guns in grades 3 and up with fishtails? I do not recall ever seeing one.
To legitimize my post, I have had many top lever 16ga guns (0 frame), and do not recall any which would not open with the right hammer cocked. My only TL 12 with a fishtail would not, which doesn't make sense, as the wider the frame, the further the hammer is to the right, seemingly making it More likely to open.

Just a thought maybe a dumb one too but I have wondered if the fishtail lever was for us left handed shooters to give a edge as its closer to the left side when we open a sxs

Not to hijack the original intent of this thread, but since it has the attention of Fish Tail folks; Do any of you, have, had, or know of guns in grades 3 and up with fishtails? I do not recall ever seeing one.

Edgar,
I have a grade 3 and grade 4 both with fishtail top levers. They are both 1905 guns.

Wayne, are they both hammer guns and do they both open with the right hammer cocked?

That would be in keeping with the original question posed in this thread.





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Dean,
Both guns were mentioned in my first post keeping with the original question posed.

This 'Ex Libris Dean Romig' 16 gauge 0-frame Grade 1 opens easily with the right hammer cocked.



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Here's another 0-frame Grade 1 16 gauge that also opend with the right hammer cocked.



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I have a Grade 3 fishtail dating to 1888.

Yet another 0-frame 16 gauge Grade-1 that opens with the right hammer cocked.



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Scott, does it open with the right hammer cocked?





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I have a grade 3 #1 frame 12 from 1887 with a fishtail top lever, it opens with the hammer cocked.

I have a Grade-4 12 gauge 1-frame that opens with the right hammer cocked and doesn’t need a fish tail lever.



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Being a Lefty, I can say assuredly, it's not a dumb thought.

Two of my hammer guns open with hammer back my D grade no just a bit

Are they straight kever or fishtail?





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Straight sorry

Dean,

Gun opens with right hammer cocked and fishtail touches the hammer. It is a 2 frame.

Fishtail
16 zero frame opens with rh cocked
12 1 frame opens with rh cocked

My #2 frame hammer gun with a fishtale lever will not open with the right hammer cocked.

This answer isn’t going to help your survey ....... but I have some that do and some that don’t . But I gotta say I’m no advocate of closing and opening with the hammers cocked on live chambers .

It is much safer to open a gun with a cocked hammer than it it to lower the hammer where the hammer can slip from your thumb…
We do it all the time with hammerless guns… and I put little faith in a manual safety as I have seen a few of those fail.





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So if a gun will not open with a fishtail lever and right hammer cocked the thought of the reason for the fishtail lever of being able to carry a gun open and cocked is not the reason for a fishtail lever Just asking . And why would you have one on a Hammerless

Dean if your manual safety would fail or you take it off safe you would still have to pull the trigger or you would have worn sears ect for the gun to discharge. Yes ?

The jury’s still out on why the fishtail lever was originally developed. There seems to be no distinct rhyme or reason for it. It has always been accepted that it was to facilitate opening the gun with the right hammer cocked but there are so many coming forth that seem to dispel that theory…

Fishtail levers on hammerless guns was simply to use up existing stock of fishtail levers.





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Yes!…. But accidents do happen don’t they.

Likewise, the same would need to occur on a hammerless gun - but opening it makes it completely safe from accidental discharge without the need to touch a hammer or a trigger.





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So you carry all your sxs open is what your saying

I've been following both fishtail threads and find it interesting, although I have no guns and no experience with them. However, I saw something on eBay this morning (Item 144476752616) which triggered a question. It is a listing for a used hammerless fishtail lever. One of the pictures shows the back, which has four distinct stamps. Three don't particularly look like numbers in the picture but one is clearly a 1 . The question that comes to mind is:

Were the fishtails marked on the back as to frame size?

I doubt many people have removed, and then examined one, except for a professional. If they were, then the examples which won't open while cocked may be replacements or simply wrong sizes installed at the factory. The first doesn;t seem likely, given the number already reported in a few posts. The latter doesn't seem very Parker like.

Using up the leftover ones on hammerless guns would be an obvious move in either case.

My personal thought had always been that they were made for left handed shooters, since they put the lever in a location for a left handed shooter which is a mirror image of a right hand image when new. Another possible reason is that larger gauges and frames were popular during this period and people were smaller on average. This lever may have been easier for people with small hands to cock the left lock. I would vote for the left hand reason. Occum's razor.

As for they used up the inventory on hammerless guns Im not set on that because if I ordered a gun back in the day and I have seen no letter as to what lever was ordered and it came with a fish lever I would send it back. So its still a mystery to me .

I often even carry my hammerless guns , with functioning safety, open a lot of the time while in the field.





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