Info on serial # 190094 from the serialization book erial #190094
 

This was my Grandfather's gun. 20 guage DHE , 0 frame with a single trigger. The barrels measure 26" and they touch. The keels look right based on the pics I have seen online but the matting runs to the end.

Wondering if they have been cut down.

Any info would be greatly appreciatted.

Chris

Sorry, Chris. There is no listing for that number in the Serialization book, And no records in the PGCA records for a letter.
Parker Bros did produce some guns with rib pattern running to the end of the barrels.
I suggest you get bore and choke dimensions, minimum wall thickness and the depth at which choke taper starts.

Or post some good high-resolution pictures of your gun here. I, for one, would really like to see it. That serial number is within the period where many of us think Parker Bros. engraving was at its finest.





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As David pointed out, sometimes the rib matting runs to the end on original length barrels. I have one, confirmed in the records.

If you can measure the length of the chokes, and they are long as is typical of Parkers, that can be another piece of corroborating evidence.

I have measured Parker choke tapers as long as 6 1/4".





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At what point does choke length become suspicious? I have a VHE that letters with 26, but currently sports correctly numbered 28’s with no termination line. I now have the means to measure choke constriction so I was hoping to put to bed question number 2, were they cut? Are they original is buried among the Griffen and Howe records from VD&L that are no longer accessible….

Generally speaking, the tighter the constriction the longer the taqper. If the choke tapers too quickly damage to the shot pellets may occur, causing flyers and disturbing the pattern and the Parker Bros. barrel borers and finishers knew this.

What is your choke constriction in thousandths of an inch and how long are the choke tapers?





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Dean,

The right barrel is 0.025, the left is 0.039. Both start constricting about 4.5” in from the muzzle.

That sounds about right to me Dylan. I would not suspect your barrels have been cut. Sometimes due to damage the muzzles get trimmed back 1/8” or so but that’s all I would think.





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They are 28” on the button, just lacking the terminating line and the letter further confused the matter. I will die on the hill of a stock book error. Luckily, it’s not a super unique configuration or grade.

Pics of 190094
 

Have the barrels been cut ?

Barrel Pics
 

Pics of the barrel this time.

From where I sit, no and upon closer examination, the termination line is barely visible at the very end. Beautiful gun. Use it in good healthy

Thank you for the response. This was my Grandfather's on my Mother's side.He gave it to my Dad sometime in the 1960s and he gave it to me in 1980. I wish I knew more of the story of where my Grandfather got it but he has been gone a long time. Dad died last year so there is no one left to ask about it. I do remember my Dad always loved it. It will be my Son's someday. Thanks again.

I do have one question about the trigger. I can't find much about it. Is it factory or aftermarket ?

That is a Parker factory single selective trigger.

I agree with Jim Dispagno's assessment of the top rib.





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I guess I'm the one in every crowd that has a different opinion. I do not see what looks like a termination line on the rib. It appears to be more of a chamfer
as done to remove a sharp edge after cutting, to my eyes. And, I cannot see defined keels, it looks more like solid lead solder.
I may be wrong and I will retract my opinion if everybody agrees that the barrels appear uncut, but I'm not convinced yet.
I'd like Brian Dudley, Edgar Spencer or Drew Hause to chime in on this. I would trust any one of their opinions.

What a great gun.

I took another look at the end of the barrels and can't determine if it is solder or steel. A magnet will stick but it does have the color of solder too.

They do measure 26" on the nose.

A family member was looking after the gun while my parents and I lived overseas in the mid 1970s. Dad went to get the gun back when we got home and found out it had been given to a local Parker collector to settle a debt. Dad called the guy right away and told him in no uncertain terms that the gun was his and we were heading over to pick it up.

When we got there he told us he had the barrels reblued. Maybe he had them cut down or who knows. He bought and sold a lot of Parkers and was the local expert and not some hack.

Dad took the gun and gave it to me on the spot. Guess the guy was SOL on the debt.

I will pass the gun to my son one day but I would be interested in an approximate value range with the reblue and possibly cut down barrels.

Any and all info and opinions are greatly appreciatted.

Chris

That’s a tough one. Cut is one thing, reblued is another. It will be hard to find an example of that configuration that has both modifications and sold recently, unless someone here keeps meticulous records on sale price of modified guns….

So that isn’t a very helpful comment, but I would start by researching the online auction sites for recent sales, not asking price, of the same configuration. My gut tells me that is going to be a project. Alternatively you could seek an appraisal for a nominal fee.

You’re going to get a wide range of responses that are all what that particular person would be willing to pay. It is not clear. Personally, I wouldn’t trifle much with it since it’s clear to me there are no plans to sell it. I would just tell your son it’s great grandpas gun and that should exceed the monetary value, I would hope.

On those spots beneath the upper and lower ribs where the keels would be seen, take a needle and scratch it. A steel keel will hardly scratch at all but solder will…





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I just tried a needle, and it will scratch it so that seems to answer that question.

As far as the value goes, I am interested mostly for insurance purposes.

This gun has been a part of my family for close to 100 years so it is not and will not be for sale.

Thanks everyone for your input and information.

Chris

Not sure what your plan is but if it’s to use your homeowners policy I would make sure you understand that carefully. By the time I properly insured my guns through my homeowners it became cost prohibitive. It was cost optimized for me to have home owners through one, and an entirely different provider for my guns. A lot of homeowner policies are basically worthless for insuring guns unless you specifically schedule them, which significantly increases your premium and still requires a formal appraisal.

At least, that is what I came to Learn when I crossed the insurance bridge.

My homeowners company only covered a tiny amount and would not let me add a rider. I wound up buying a policy from a company that specializes in firearms. It is pretty reasonable and adds some piece of mind. Hopefully, I will never need it but it's there just in case.

That is what most of us do, I believe.

I had no idea mine weren't covered until my Father in Law mentioned to me that he had to add a rider. The gun insurance company I use does not require any info about particular guns. The only exception is a single gun is worth $ X amount. Then you have to give them info about that gun only. I don't remember the magic dollar amount. I'm pretty sure it would be below that number but that's why I was wondering a rough price range. Right now I have coverage based on my estimate for the value of my guns. Just don't want a surprise if I did have a theft or a fire or something.

When I look at the picture of the top end of the barrels, for some reason the right barrel looks shorter than the left barrel. Try using a carpenter's square to see if they are straight across. Either way I would not worry about it as it was you grandfather's gun.

If you have trouble posting pics or you're not sure how to do it, contact Bill Murphy and he'll square you away.

Instead of using a homeowner's policy to insure your guns, contact Gun & Trophy Insurance. They advertise in Parker Pages. Great to deal with and the best premiums around. So much better than having to give an insurance company a roster of your guns. That itself doesn't make me feel warm and fuzzy inside. PLUS, if you are a PGCA member they wave the admin fees.

Shoot it and enjoy it and when you're through leave it to your son or grand kids. Just enjoy the Dam thing.