My latest arrival
 

I've been waiting awhile for my latest Parker purchase to finally arrive. There is a Canada Post strike going on so no packages or mail has been moving through them for the past few weeks. CP is the only way to ship a firearm to an individual here, though UPS will ship to a firearms business. I found a business about an hour away willing to take it and picked it up on Monday.
She's a VH 16 with a capped pistol grip stock and 26" barrels. Sounds like a nice nimble little grouse gun so far. I'm not a big fan of 26" barrels. Too fast and whippy. That's not a problem with this one. The wee beast is 8 lbs, five oz. I did a few quick measurements and there are a few things that make me wonder. It is a 3 frame. She was made in 1904 and the serial number appears to have order book and stock book info so I'm hoping the letter sheds more light on it's purpose.

Be interesting to measure the chokes. A tightly choked 26" would seem odd, but an 8-1/4 # 16 gauge upland gun would seem even more so.

Did you buy through an auction or a sales listing? Any info there?

Well I stand corrected on a few counts with this one. Chuck Bishop was on the site when I made my first post and emailed an electronic copy of the letter. Good thing, with the CP strike the hard copy probably won't get here till well into the new year. 123192 is actually a 2 1/2 frame, not a 3. I didn't even know that was a thing. The firing pins are still 1 3/16" apart by my measurement. I just went through the frames section in The Parker Story volume 2 to learn more about the 2 1/2 frame and it doesn't even mention it. Has anybody seen one? The letter doesn't mention the chambers. I'll have to take a more careful measurement. It looks to me to be at least 2 3/4, maybe 2 7/8" long. My first impression is there is very little of a drop in diameter from the end of the chambers to the bores. I thought maybe made for brass cases. The weight in the letter is 8 lbs 1 oz. It has a rubber recoil pad now that probably accounts for the difference. The chokes are cylinder left. and right at most a light full.
I bought this out of a region of thick bush, salmon rivers, prospectors, and brown bears. At first I thought it was ordered to make a slug gun that could handle heavy slugs at good velocities in case of a charge from a bear, or knock over a rabbit or bird for the pot while still light enough to carry. I don't think there were any brown bears in Massachusetts, even in 1903. I've attached the letter and will get some photos up soon. All comments on the original owner and the gun are welcome.

I bet that is a typo? At that weight it sure is a beefy one though!

Not a typo!!! I've seen mention of 2 1/2 frames every once and a while. Good measurements of the frame by Bob will help determine if it's a simple 3 frame or a combination of a 2 or 3 frame.

Now I recall discussion that the 2 1/2" is the measurement across the breech balls of a 3 frame gun. But I don't know a lot about nothing.

Not saying you or anyone else is incorrect , but I’d like to see one with 2 1/2 stamped on the barrel lug .

"2 1/2" is an internal term used in the Parker factory for a #3 frame. The lug marking will be 3. My #3 frame 16 is similar to yours except heavier. I will look up the serial number of another #3 frame 16 that I located when researching my gun. It may be your gun. Stay tuned.

Wow what an interesting gun! Picture would be appreciated.

Does anyone know why? Seems weird they wouldn’t just call it a 3.

There is no such thing as a 2-1/2 frame as we know it in regards to frame sizes on barrel lugs. Any reference to that in a letter or the records are referring to the frame size as measured across the breech balls.

Now that's an interesting gun.

Bill, I came across a couple of mentions of 3 frame 16s when I searched the forum. There was your 28", and I think a DH with longer barrels was mentioned by someone in the same thread as having been seen. I can't search the archive section. This VH is 2.51" across the breach balls, the same as a standard 3 frame.
The lug stamp isn't well defined, but it looks like the bottom half of a 3. I'll include a photo of it when I post pics and measurements tomorrow.

I doubt they would have chambered for brass shells in 2003 but you never know. I would think that would have been noted. At that time, forcing cones were pretty short and abrupt.

:corn::corn::corn:

Photos
 

Here are a few photos of the chamber end of the barrels and the lug. The rim recess is fairly deep. These cheddite hulls go past flush in the chambers. More to follow.

Here is a couple of the left side of the action. What would you like to see?

When I first looked at the empty chamber picture I thought they looked big and somewhat off center due to camera angle. Looking at the second, the shells still look off center in the chamber, and not due so much to viewing angle. Are they lose in the chamber in addition to being deep?

Here is one of the full left side. The letter has the stock at 13.25". Its now 13 1\4" to the end of the wood, and 14 1/4 to the end of the pad. There is no peak inlet and no serial number or grade stamp under the trigger guard.

No, they are tight in the chambers. I think they look a little off center due to the shadow cast by the exposed rim due to the shells seating past the end of the chambers. That was poorly worded. The shadow is cast by the chamber wall when the hull enters past the start of the chamber. That's poorly worded as well, but I hope you understand what i meant.

What a unique beast of a gun! A great find.

That gun is so cool, your a fortunate man to own it. It makes me smile and an example of Parker would honor about any customer request. Well done!

Looks like you have a problem with the chambers. It looks like they may have been improperly sleeved and/or recut off center & too deep. It may not even fire if the primer is too far in the chamber. Looks like someone worked on it that didn't know what he was doing. If I had bought this I'd be sending it back & get my money back

Sorry for the break in my posts. It's been a busy few days and I wanted to shoot it to test the function before posting.
You've got a great eye, David. The chambers have been sleeved. There is a reason I don't hunt with iron sights anymore. Other than the rim recess being deep they appear to be straight and functional. I was out on initial chamber measurement. They are a little shorter than 2 3/4". The action is tight and on face. I had two types of 16 gauge shells on hand to test it out. First was the British made Kent Gamebore Traditional Game, 2 1/2", 7/8 oz that was pictured in the loose barrel chambers. The other was the Federal Game Load 2 3/4", 1 oz, 2 1/2 dram load. All fired without a problem. The primer strikes are all deep, but not too deep. I had thought there might be some backing out of the primers or case head distortion but there was none. I don't know the pressures of the Federal load, but the Gamebore are 8200 psi. They seemed pretty snappy earlier in the season when I was hunting with a 6 pound W. Collath, but both brands were very gentle in this one.
I bought it out of a small online auction. It appeared to be a dispersal of a collection of interesting guns, mostly rifles. Quite a few didn't get a minimum bid and I bought this one at one notch above the minimum. There were just several poor pictures of each item. There was no weight in the item description, but it did say it was a 16 on a 10 gauge frame. I knew how rare that was but it seemed nobody else knew or cared so I got it cheap. So no returns, but I wouldn't have considered that in any case. Besides, I may never make it down to a big vintager event, but if I do I bet she would look pretty cool in the rack with her competitors in a small bore event:).

Now for the measurements
 

I followed the frame and barrel measurements on page 527 of volume 2 of the Parker Story. The measurements in the TPS were done with a ruler in fractions and I used a digital caliper. I could list them all out, but as mentioned in earlier posts by some of our experts they match the dimensions of the 3 frame almost exactly. Even the barrel diameter at the muzzle end of the flats (measurement F) matches the diameter of a 10 gauge 3 frame. I look forward to Mr. Murphy posting the serial number and letter info for his 3 frame 16. It would be interesting to see the chokes, when it was made, and where it was shipped.

I had a few questions on the cylinder/full chokes mentioned in the letter. When I measured them I got cylinder and .019" restriction which I thought would be modified? As well it lists 100 pellets in the cylinder and 160 pellets in the choked barrel in a 30" circle at 40 yards with #7 shot. Was Parker using the British #7 description for what North Americans now call #7.5? From looking at photos of hang tags Parker used 7/8 oz for their choke testing on the 20 gauge. Did they use 1 oz for the 16? If 1 oz of 7.5 that would be 350 pellets. 160 out of 350 would be about 46%. Am I off the the choke designation? Thanks. Just trying to learn here.