US INTERNATIONAL S/S CHAMPIONSHIP
 

Has anyone here heard of or participated in this event?
Bob Jurewicz

https://keystoneshootingpark.com/wp-...NS-PROGRAM.pdf

Never heard of it , but ........ I find it quite Intresting :whistle:

Interesting but, isn't it a bit optimistic to call an event an "International Championship" when the range capacity is only 30 shooters?

I didn’t notice the 30 shooter part . That would be a bit disappointing !

I believe “international” refers to the type of trap and skeet. That is, international trap, or bunker, and international skeet. Different setup and rules compared to American trap and American skeet.

Well ............ color me embarrassed. Being wrapped up in the world of sporting clays and hunting I had no idea. Thanks, John.

I'm not a trap shooter. 20-21 is good for me. Shot 3 rounds of bunker at Hillsdale college. Remember you are allowed 2 shots at each bird. I shot 5,6, and 1.

Doubt I'll shoot it again

I wanna try bunker trap before they throw the dirt on top of me . International skeet I’d try as well but low gun and faster targets isn’t gonna make it easy .

I have always shot Skeet with low gun (at my waist) regardless of the gun I used. Never broke 25 but a lot of 24’s, 23’s, 22’s etc.
I was shooting a friend’s Perazzi low gun and when I got to station 8 low he told me in his heavy Greek accent “No, no - mount da gun! You can no break dem wit a low gun. Mount da gun o you gonna shoot way behin dem!”

I proceeded to turn them both into “diesel smoke”. He said “I canno believe dat, I canno believe!”





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As far as I know the only true bunker trap set up in NY is at Binghamton Gun Club. 15 traps set to go at three different angles each I believe. It is FAST. I've shot it a dozen times, best score I've gotten was 21, the worst was like a 12. I would think an XF choked SBT gun would a blast but you sacrifice that second shot you're allowed. By the time you get your second shot off I think that bird is at 50+ yards away. Vernon and Rochester Brooks have "international trap" but it's not a true set up, there are only 3 or 5 traps I believe on a wobble set up. There is a gentleman who built this setup with his own money some years back who was trying to make the 2004 Olympic trap team (he didn't make the final cut but still shoots there). There is also international skeet there but that's way too freaking fast.

Hillsdale is now the headquarters for several of the Olympic shooting teams. They have 5 bunker fields and 5 International skeet facilities. As Andy pointed out there are 15 traps in the trench at a bunker facility. At $5K/trap, that's $75K just in traps at each facility. Add in computer controls, etc. etc. and you're beginning to get into real money.

The birds are thrown substantially faster than American trap birds. As a result, standard clay targets won't withstand the launching pressure, so the birds are stouter (I think the same is true for International skeet). I don't know how you could make it more difficult.

Here's info on the facility. https://shootingsports.hillsdale.edu/

If any of you have youngsters who show aptitude as competitive shooters, check out Hillsdale. A conservative college which takes no federal money ( which pi**es off Washington)and as a result is never shown n any national rankings. They have won the National shooting competition about the last 6 years, and offer scholarships for shooting.

A friend who shoots compitition International Trap and shoots at Brooks and Binghamton brought this event to my attention. I believe it to be unique in that it is exclusively a S/S event. He will be attending to compete and I may go as an observer.
Bob Jurewicz

So if the clays are harder to withstand the increased torque of the trap I’ll bet they’re harder to break with typical American Skeet loads…





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From a 2009 posting
In true International (Olympic) competition, the following quote from the ISSF rules will apply.

9.4.3 AMMUNITION
9.4.3.1 Cartridge Specifications
Cartridges permitted in ISSF competitions must meet the following specifications:
• case length after firing must not exceed 70 mm
• shot charge must not exceed 24.5 g
• pellets must be spherical in shape
• pellets must be made of lead, lead alloy or of any other ISSF approved material
• pellets must not exceed 2.6 mm in diameter
• pellets may be plated
• black powder, tracer, incendiary, or other special type cartridges are prohibited
• no internal changes may be made which will give an extra or special dispersion effect, such as the inverse loading of components, crossing devices, etc.

However, I believe a relaxation of those rules have been allowed in the USA for some shoots, such as local and regional competitions. I think in those cases, a full 7/8 ounce load can still be used. When it gets to the team selection competitions, I believe the ISSF rules kick in and the true 24 gram loads are required. I don't have access to a USA Shooting rule book to verify this for sure, but thats the way it was a few years back

The course of fire in American vs International skeet is slightly different . As well as the targets being cranked up faster . I dunno if they use a harder rimmed bird but I’d not be surprised. Low gun at American skeet is fun and like yourself I’ve shot plenty decent scores although I usually base how good it was out of 100 or atleast 50 .

What would really make this Intresting was if you had to use the same gun no changing chokes for all three events .

I believe they're harder to break as I've seen more than one bird "wobble" and nothing chip off. Usually those guys who insist on using #9 which is too small. I did well with Federal Gold Medal paper #7.5 in a Caesar Guerini Ascent choked IM/LF. I have one of Frank's Model 12 Trap guns, that's the deal right there, then for giggles shot it with the same loads in a Browning Gold sporting an XF Turkey choke. That smoked 'em. If there was enough interest I'm sure Binghamton could host a fun one day Int'nl Skeet/Trap event for SxS this summer and have lunch catered.

Keystone Shooting Park is a world class international shooting facility located in South Central Pa. We have 3 bunker facilities within 1 hour drive of Harrisburg. Keystone, Palmyra Sportsman's Assoc., and Ontelaunee Rod and Gun club near Allentown. Keystone features international bunker, skeet, and Helice. It's fully automated and if your a member, you can shoot by yourself. The facility will open up with a smart card without anyone else being there.

I wonder if they would allow a Parker Hammer gun to enter? Bet that would raise some eyebrows! PGCA member Anthony Pilotti has won some Helice events there shooting an O/U but he's pretty good with his Parker hammer gun.

Chuck,
I wondered if you might have some input on this venue, it is not that far from home but I've never been to see this setup. I've been to Dalmatia before for other events but never for this.
I also would like to try International bunker shooting, which of the three you suggested would be the easiest venue to try this?
Thanks,
Stan

Keystone is not far on the map but it's pretty isolated using back roads. Palmyra is much closer to you and beginner friendly. Check their web site. Usually shoot on Saturdays

Not meaning to hijack the thread , but what’s the address of the place you put on the shoot before the Southern ? And if possible your date ?

April 9, 2022 Blue Ridge Sportsmans Club, Harrisburg Pa. Just a fun shoot, no trophys.

Ontelaunee has had bunker trap set up for decades. Alan Chubb was the driving force there. They hosted quite a few truly international events.

I read the shoot flier. Even though I am not a fan of shooting trap, I am intrigued at this event and will consider entering. I can see the Parker VHE live bird gun in action for all three events.

Hammer guns are welcomed.

Not so bad 3 1/2 hours from me .

I know hammer guns are ok but Damascus barrels may not be allowed.

Mike, I'll bring popcorn.:rotf:

The birds contain a higher clay content and are fired (baked) at a higher temperature than standard trap & skeet targets in order to survive the increased acceleration rate and higher launch velocity of international trap machines. A bird may "wobble" from the blast of a shot charge passing it, but a truly erratic flight path is the result of a trap malfunction and in registered competition should be called a "no target."

Anyone shooting #9 shot in bunker competition has already won a medal for pissing into the wind: the key to breaking long-range targets in bunker is a high velocity load of high-antimony content # 7 1/2 shot, plated shot is even better. The Italians brought over regulation competition loads for the annual Grand Prix at Ontelaunee that were within the 7/8 oz. limit for shot weight, but approached the velocity of steel shot waterfowl loads using an Oehler chronograph at the range. The notorious "Melior Meteors" clocked out at close to 1400 fps at 1 meter from the muzzle. "Fast targets, fast shot."

Frank's chokes and XF tubes won't help you if you're using Wally World ballistic profile ammo; this most demanding of all shotgun games requires specifically designed ammo for reliable and consistent results in competition.

Agree 100%. I

The "golden age" of the bunker at Ontelaunee was essentially from 1990-2001. There were usually 4 major International shoots per year, including the Grand Prix of America, which drew shooters from Great Britain, Germany, Italy, Portugal, Spain, Australia and New Zealand. Michael Diamond, Olympic Gold Medal winner in International trap in Atlanta in 1996 and Sydney in 2000, along with the ladies' All-England champion from Wales joined us in 2 successive seasons.

Alan Chubb always put on a first class event program; everything started ON TIME, there were awards for every event class, and the machinery and layout were as good or better as any other facility in the US, which at the time, numbered less than 30 in the continental US. The facility still hosts registered shoots in the beautiful valley in New Tripoli PA, about 30 minutes northeast of Allentown PA.

What, you have doubts?? :nono:

This is a new event. And it is for SxS guns only. Some of the SxS shooters who go there regularly encouraged Mr. Chubb to create the event. If it gets good interest, I expect it will continue.

In the past, participation at Keystone has been poor, very poor for skeet events. I'm not sure about the Helice events. I hope participation has been better recently. I can't find results or shooter numbers on the website. Don't worry, a capacity of 30 shooters is enough for the side by side event. I hope I can make it.