London Calling(william Evans)
 

So I wish to express my gratitude to those of you who have been answering my questions both on the forum and in pm's regarding english guns.

I had originally had an interest in possibly adding a 2 inch jeffery to the stable and that led me in a variety of directions, but after researching gun info, talking to others who are far more knowledgeable than I, and emailing with various individuals I put a deposit down with Kirby at Vintage Doubles on what his description refers to and my research supports is a "Best" boxlock.

No it isn't a purdey or an H & H or a Boss or even a Greener which I grew up hearing about whenever the subject of American or English shotguns came up in my family, but it fits my budget and from what Kirby has told me and the pictures I have, it will do nicely for me as my English Gun. Anyway pics are below. It weighs in at 6lbs 3oz, 28 inch barrels, .023 and .021 minimum barrel thickness, built in 1909, it was one of a pair originally I gather and have been told based off the gold #1 on it, it has bushed firing pins and intercepting safety sears, choked at .022 left and .007 right, with 14.5 LOP.

Beautiful gun Bill. I love those lines, and the finish of course.





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A beautiful gun! I'm sure you will find it to your liking.

Sounds like you have done your home work Bill. One thing for sure is that Kirby will not steer you wrong. He is a true class act and someone that I would buy from with 100% confidence which I have. Best of luck with the new addition !

Well done, sir!

You have chosen wisely.

Bill, I love the Evans guns, own a matched pair that are my regular shooting guns. However, I would not recommend a high mileage gun, half of a pair, with a repaired stock and .021 wall thickness to anyone at any price. I agree that Kirby is an upfront guy, but this gun would not be for me. I would have sent this message by PM, but then the other posters would not hear another opinion contrary to theirs. This gun probably has a Webley screw grip action, a wonderful design, but possibly made by Scott, not Evans. To be honest, my excellent sidelock Evans guns may have been made by Scott also, not a detriment to the quality of my guns or yours. Good luck with your purchase.

Bill, I'm sure that Kirby shared the bore diameters with you, but his ads don't seem to include that important information. For your information, my guns, 1911 guns, measure .731, .731, .731, and .733. I can't locate the wall thickness measurements in my files, but I measured all four at the time of purchase, and they were to me very acceptable figures, certainly not .21 or .022. I think that my guns and yours were probably the nominal .729 or close to that, at the time of manufacture.

I have them back home. Running around helping ranchers deal with our Army Worm invasion currently. I will post the bore diameters and the proof marks when I get back home.

Bill, I repeat, good luck with your purchase.

Bill congrats on a nice gun. I'm sure you will enjoy it just as much as a Parker.

Grabbing a late lunch and back at it, but the bores measured .737 and were proofed at .733.

As I understand such things, anything under .743 would be considered still in proof?

My first Parker DH measured .021 in one of its damascus barrels but I was assured it was safe (with light loads) by the knowledgeable gentleman I had contacted looking for one. He was right.

This gun is me dipping my toe across the pond by dealing with a knowledgeable dealer who has a reputation for being fair. I am not looking for me to be able to turn around in 10-20 years and make a big profit on it. Its a learning experience for me on a gun that appeals to me.

I thank you for your due concern Mr. Murphy and take no offense at all at your wise and safe advice. In fact I greatly appreciate it.

I may very well at some point regret the money spent on it....I doubt it....but I do not think I will regret the experience or the education it will provide.

Also, I picked up a book on W & C Scott as what I have found online claims that they more or less built all the guns for Evans and Evans may or may not have done nothing more than have their name put on it. So it should be interesting reading.

That isn't uncommon and if I recall correctly the actions of many labels such as Wesley Richards, Army/Navy, Evans, Scott etc are all based on the same or very similar action.

Do yourself a favor and get some 2 inch shells from RST. If you buy a flat and don't like them I'll buy them from you BUT I know you'll love them I sure do.

Proof marks which I believe indicate proofed in 1997?

Have a question that I am sure one of you guys can answer, I own two guns that were made across the pond so to speak, are they English guns or Birmingham and what is the difference? The guns in question is a 28 bore William Atkinson with the jones underlever, and a Charles Hellis 410bore both are back action and steel barreled and of course side by sides, just curious to know Gary

William Atkinson and/or William Atkinson & Son is listed at various Lancaster addresses from1874-1966.

Charles Hellis was established in 1884, 21 Shrewsbury Rd, London, became Charles Hellis & Son in 1902, absorbed by AG&L in 1960, restarted as Hellis Beesley & Watson in 1984, and is now Charles Hellis & Sons (again) at 10 Harness Way, Albans, Herts.

Little difference in WHERE English guns are made. It's the quality level they're made to. Still, "name" London guns carry a social prestige B'ham guns do not.

Being small bores, both your guns are quite desirable.

As I am learning in my research, many so called "London guns" were actually made in Birmingham, but there is still a prestige level attached to that london address.

Interesting info, and I thank you, Gary

The overall quality and fit and finish and ability to stand up to shooting and abuse will determine whether an unknown maker of the small bore gun will be acceptable for us to own. If I wanted to own a smallbore gun, I would attempt to find a name brand gun or one that is very sound based on personal inspection.

Congrats......................on your purchase.

And that is why I called it an education. This Evans is a fine fine gun, but I just can't feel the attachment/nostalgia I feel when I look at/shoot/mess with my Parkers.

It is just a gun in the safe. It shoots great, the straight stock is an adjustment but nothing too serious there, but it just doesn't get the blood pumping like guns I like tend to.

I can see that I will probably be sending this one down the road in the near future. Shame, it is a fine gun, but its just a gun to me and I don't have room in the safe for just a gun.

My anglophile great uncle is rolling over in his grave as I write this and saying he was right not to leave me his Greener when he died.......

From everything that I hear and read the best buys right now in doubles are in English boxlocks. But, there were many makers, Evans being one of the better know and They are still in Business.

Sorry to hear you will be sending this great gun "down the road". Even though my Parkers ring my bell more than some others, I like to keep my guns for the long haul, regardless of their pedigree. I shot my Evans sidelock Sunday at our sporting clays rendezvous and experienced some outstanding stations. Then I returned to my local club and broke in my new 20 gauge Trojan. Neither are going "down the road" soon.

I recently said goodbye to a Charles Boswell best boxlock 20. A nice gun that deserved more use than it was getting from me.

The English were on to something with the light 12's. I
am not a 12 gauge guy but a Purdey light game gun at just over 6lbs with 27 inch barrels choked .004 & .008 is a dream with RST 2 inch shells

I would also like a light Purdey, but it would just duplicate the characteristics of my pair of sidelock Evans guns at 6 pounds, 6 ounces. However, I would be a sucker for a 30" 1 1/4 ounce proof hammerless Purdey pigeon gun. These guns are usually in the 7 1/4 to 7 1/2 pound range.

Its a great gun. I just don't shoot it and it just takes up space in the safe. I am much more prone to keep my parkers in the rotation then grab it. I would just get more enjoyment out of the nice parker that could be sitting there rather than the evans currently.

Anyway we shall see.

Light 12s are nice. The first DH I bought from Dave Fjeline was I believe 6 3/4 lbs with 28" barrels on a 1 frame and that thing was a joy to shoot.

Bill if I got rid of the guns I don't shoot often the safe would be a pretty bare place:rotf:

I only have a few 12 ga English guns the Greener Pigeon gun and my Boss round action that has 27" barrels and weights 6 and half pounds, its a joy to shoot and carry. Feels like you are carrying a twenty gauge.

"A Boss gun? A Boss gun? Bloody beautiful but too bloody expensive!" - King George VI

What would the king think of a Boss 20ga hammer gun:eek::whistle: