Don't know what I've got--but I like it
 

Local gun show Saturday, found this little 16 hammer gun on dealers table--made a lowball offer he accepted. I think it is Belgium, but proof marks are hard to read. I cannot make out the inscription on the rib, but looks like
Joseph Bart???--doesnt look like Bayard. The barrels are fluid steel,just under 30"(75cm) and are choked cyl/full. Nice engraving on gun. Has a pivot lever to remove forearm, cheekpiece, and of course sling swivels. Wood in good condition, weighs 6lbs or less by feel. It is a little off face--small shim tightened it right up . Havent had a chance to shoot it yet, but feels exactly like my little 20 J Manton Belgium hammer gun. I'm into it for $300.

Cool looking gun

I don't know what you have, either, but you could be a bit more clear about the markings.

I like the black powder fences.....that is a much nicer than average Belgian gun if it is indeed Belgian. It looks like it has been well used, and shows no sign of fatigue.

you got a bargain in that little 16 been a parker woulda been way more...charlie

Looks like $300.00 well spent. Will you be bringing it to Ernies?

Bill, I have some pictures of the proof marks, but they are hard to see, I'll try and post them tomorrow. There is an L with an asterick above it on each barrel, I thought might stand for Leige. The also a double E or double figure 8, on each barrel, that shows up in search for Belgian proof marks. on the barrel flats is stamped Nicht Fur Kusfl--not sure about that last spelling, its very hard to make out. Also stamped ETT. Will post pics tomorrow.
Austin, yes will probably bring it.

Great looking gun for the money.

Nice score Harold. Looking forward to seeing it at Ernie's.

That is a nice gun and I think it is a high end leigh gun. If it didnt have the cheek piece I would have guessed it was English.

That’s purdy ... not Purdey, just purdy. Great wood. Great buy.

-Victor

A few more pic's. Cant seem to get much better quality pictures.

Great gun Harold. Bring it to the Southern. Someone will be able to id it.

It's difficult for me to see, but I believe it has German BP proofs. And Mr. Franzen is correct. The German Gun Collectors will be there, and most likely able to shed some light.

Anyone know what "NICHT FUR KURSL" would mean--not for ??. I cant make out the last letters even with a magnifying glass. And yes I do now believe this a German, not a Belgian gun--still havent shot it yet

Not for ball?

not for ball was an early mark designating a choked barrel

Anyone know what "NICHT FUR KURSL" would mean-

From my somewhat limited German Harold I think it has something to do with corn kurls.... but I could be wrong, I often am.:bigbye:

Aha, that makes sense, the gun is choked cyl/Full

That resembles an Austrian proof mark in the upper right barrel flat all by its self. (in your photo).

Interesting, hopefully the German Gun Collectors Guild will be able to ID it at the Southern. I went to their website, but was unsuccessful in registering--kept getting kicked back. I will google Austrian makers and proofmarks,

Shot the gun finally at Hunting Hills Vintage shoot this weekend, and loved it. It is very light, and even 7/8's ounce loads at 1150 fps had a liitle bite to them. I am going to load up a few hundred 3/4 oz loads for it. That should soften up the recoil a little.

I'm sure that's Kugel, for 'Ball'