Is this N stocked with English Walnut
 

I am not a wood expert but the top N grade appears to be stocked in English walnut and the bottom gun American walnut?? What say you??

Looks like it to me. Is the upper gun an early one?

A lot of early GHs got circassian put on them, but i cant say that i have personally seen N/P grades with it before.

The upper gun is 116794 the bottom gun is 149937

Not all that early then.

Brian this is a GHE Damascus barreled 20 that's been cleaned up. What do you think the wood is? The ONLY thing I know about wood is pretty VS ugly:rotf:

Lets try that picture again

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Hey Rich thanks for hijacking my thread. :nono:

It appears to me that they are both American walnut.

According to all the Parker Bros. advertising and catalogs I've seen, imported walnut (Circassian, European, etc.) was only used on Grade 3 and higher and that Grade 2 and lower had American black walnut. In my opinion, American black walnut used on older guns like Parker, Lefever, LC Smith, AH Fox, and several other makers of about a hundred years or so ago looked somewhat different than the black walnut used on more recent guns. Generally speaking the wood used in stock making then was from much older, larger, more mature trees than that used for stocks on more recent guns. Therefor, the grain and figure will have a different look and sometimes the American black walnut used on the older guns can be confused with European or Circassian walnut in appearance.


(Craig, Rich just likes to show off his pajamas.);)




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Lefever used imported walnut on all their guns and they advertised as so.

Thanks for the correction Brian.





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Dean that's a good explanation and it makes sense. I've been told that it's everything from American walnut, English, Circassian etc.

By the way I don't wear pajamas:eek:

But low grade guns that are even earlier than the subject ones have walnut on them that looks like modern American walnut... huh.

Sorry, I should have been more specific on the earlier ones... I was referring to Grade 2 guns. Lower than Grade 1 guns (early) were stocked with straight grain American black Walnut. Grade 1 Parkers had American Black with a bit of figure but Grade 2 guns generally had American black with good figure but mostly on one side with the figure on the other side less pronounced.

I'm sure I've left something out....





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Craig, you might try to letter that gun. I have a Damascus GHE that was stocked with English Walnut and a skeleton butt installed. The letter confirms this.

This stock very much resembles Craigs Top Gun pictured and it is an early PH Grade ! It is serialed to the gun , I would bet American Black Walnut !

True of all walnut species, the very best grain, for eye appeal, comes from the root ball of the tree, and not above ground at crotch points.

Also don't forget that in a manufacturing situation,you sometimes have to use what materials are available.If you have to get the gun shipped and lower grade wood is not available and better wood is,you put the better wood on the gun and ship it.I had a VHE that had wood that should have been on at least a B grade.It was not special ordered.I am sure the boss said get it out the door no matter what.Remember that wood and engraving are the least expensive elements of the gun.

on a PH/NH you are probably right

not sure I would agree about the engraving cost as a flat statement - at least on higher grades

i think it is a significant factor is the increase in price as you go up the grade ladder

John, I am curious if that gun was a Remington era VHE?

It is a fact that Remington used American black walnut of a far higher grade on all of the lower grade Parkers than Parker Bros. ever, as a standard, would have used.






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No,it was a 1910 or 1911 gun.I sold it quickly because of the wood.The letter only stated the grade,gauge,and barrel length.

Years ago I worked as a forester in Kentucky. We sold native American black walnut bid by the tree with a specification that the stump height could not be less than 18 inches. After the timber was removed we sold the stumps again as an individual tree bid. Bidding was fierce and almost all of the bidders for both timber and stumps were from gun stock buyers.

OK here are two more pictures-- the first one is the left side of the #6 frame N, the second is a D grade #6 frame hammer gun. Anyone want to change their mind??

What da ya know... they look the same.

Do the initials in the second picture relate to the original owner?

Yes I believe so Martin E. Wampler, great name for a duck hunter. I have the original leg of mutton case with his name and address.
I know the catalogs read grade 1 guns are stocked with American walnut. My only purpose for making this post is because the advanced collectors on this forum have taught us one thing---never say never!!

Good looking wood, no matter what it is

The wood of those two Parkers appear to have similar appearing characteristics but that doesn't mean they were cut from the same tree, or even the same sub species of Juglans. It only serves to reinforce that there are exceptions to every rule... or to 'Never say Never.' ;)





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Both Edgars and Deans statements are entirely accurate about walnut stocks. In addition American/black walnut trees grow throughout the US where soils, growing seasons, rain fall, and seasonal temperature vary drastically. These variations will change the appearance of wood even if the trees are biologically the same. By 1937 Parker offered the D and C grades in fancy American walnut only.