Ithaca 10 G
 

Need a little Ithaca 10 G advice. Blundered into one in a gun shop today. Gave it a look and put the gun on hold until I can research it a bit more. At home had the excellent DGJ Spring and Summer 2014 articles by Frank Srebro on Ithaca's big 10's. Will go over them in detail then drive back for a closer examination next week.

Serial number is 439542, 32 inch with fairly extensive engraving. More detailed than the "Star" Ithaca's Bit strange to me is the butt stock, wood, grip checkering etc looks like the plainer grade Ithaca's. Seems to me the higher grade guns would have had fancy wood. Everything about the stocks fit says factory though. Gun is with a 20 G from the same seller that's a obvious re-stock. Wonder if the 10 had butt stock switched at some point with a factory stock intended for lesser grade.

DAH is bit less than 3 inches with a pad that looks like the one shown in Mr Srebro's part II article. Gun itself has fluid steel barrels & cocking indicators had no way to measure the chambers chokes or barrels. Do that next week, although measuring 10's is difficult with the tools I have at hand.

Armed with the DGJ issues and good advice will go back to give it a detailed inspection. I have enjoyed my Parker 10 Hammer gun and wanted to add a Parker Hammerless 10, but this Ithaca may be a nice gun to shoot. It feels nice anyhow.

Not looking for price indications, Exactly what it is and mechanical issues to look for. Would use it for Clay's with short 10 loads.

William Davis

That serial number is into the NID range

You might look for articles on the grades available in that model

Been Googling but so much clutter on Google Ithaca Grades get lost. Nothing detailed like the Parker descriptions. It might be a 1 1/2 grade based on Google Images but the photos are not real good. If it is 1 1/2 the butt stocks look fairly plain from photos.

All complicated by not having the gun in front of me. Impression of the engraving from memory is sort of like a Ideal Grade Smith.



William

Based on your description of the engraving similar to the Ideal, does it look like this?

This is from page 82 in Walt Synder's book "The Ithaca Gun Company From the Beginning .

That's the gun, and armed with Grade 1 information Google is coming up with more information.

Thanks a lot

William

William, thanks for your kind words on the articles. The Super 10's are excellent guns. That s/n dates to about 1927. The Grade stamp will be found on the front end of the water table, and on the back end of the barrel flats. F (Field), 1, 2, 3 etc. If you don't have a 10-guage chamber gauge the easiest way to check the chambers is to dismount the barrels, and using a factory 3-1/2" shelll with roll crimp, try to insert the shell. It should not fully chamber. If it does - the chambers have been lengthened. Super 10's weren't designed for 3-1/2" shells. Caveat emptor.

They were good articles and most appreciated.

I have access to a Mansion wall thickness gauge and a Skeet's Bore gauge. The Skeet's won't handle 10's for bore diamater but the Mansion will measure wall thickness. Can measure the barrel wall thickness, choke length, and chamber length with it.

Only 10 hulls I have are fired 2 7/8 RST's and new primed unfired 3 1/2 inch Remington's. Saw the photos of 3 1/2 inch shells in the 2 7/8 inch chamber. I would expect the unfired uncrimped empty 3 1/2's would do the same thing, stick out past the extractors while the fired 2 7/8 would drop all the way in.

William

A grade 1 1/2 super 10 I wouldn't spend to much time thinking about it, make sure everything checks out and buy it before you regret loosing it.

I agree with Eldon's reply.

A new 3-1/2" Remington olive-green colored hull will protrude about 9/16" from an unaltered Super 10 chamber.

I just put a new Remington hull in my Parker Hammer 10, indicated depth to extractor with a black marker . Inserted in the Ithaca ought to tell if the chamber has been lengthen

Looking through books last night. Elmer Keith has a lot of good things to say about Super 10's. Some references on line to Col Askins and the Super 10 but my Askins books can't find much, however they are not indexed might take some sifting. Paul Curtis was mentioned too, will look through his books tonight

William Davis

The No. 1 1/2 was long gone by the time the NID came along in 1926. In late 1919, Ithaca thinned out their grades when they quit offering composite iron and steel barrels after The Great War, and the bold floral engraving that had been introduced on the No. 1 1/2 in the summer of 1915 --

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...lfJuly1915.jpg

became the new No. 1 --

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...9Catalogue.jpg

When I looked at the Ithaca book last night there was no grade 1 1/2 NID so figured it was discontinued by then. Never did get the 1 1/2 grade anyways. Still you don't find a super 10 everyday and a grade 1 even more so.

Did they make a Flues 1 1/2 with fluid steel barrels ?

Never mind I read the add more carefully and answered my own question !

Gave the NID Super 10 a careful inspection yesterday. Gun seems to be unaltered. Chokes are long and measure .018 right barrel .029 Left. This with a 12 G Skeet's tool than may have bottomed out behind the choke could have more choke. Minimum wall thickness is .051. Chambers have not been altered . Took it to the range for function test it works just fine. Patterned with some RST 1 1/8 oz # 8's Nice patterns round and full. Point of impact little bit better than flat. Very shootable

http://i492.photobucket.com/albums/r...psgyc43goq.jpg

http://i492.photobucket.com/albums/r...pswxkyfdfc.jpg



Real concern was the stock. Last stop was PGCA member Danny Patton's who said he could soak the oil out and finish so the stock matches front and rear.. Replace that Pachmyer White line pad too. Shop gave be 3 day return privileges, think I am going to keep her.

William

i think if you don't - you should say so here at the 2 1/2 day mark to that the line can start forming

To measure bore diameter with a Skeet's, a Manson and a vernier caliper, mark a place on the barrel near the extent of the measuring devices. Measure wall thickness, top and bottom at this point. Use a micrometer or a caliper to measure the outside diameter of the barrel at the same place, Subtract the two wall thicknesses from the outside diameter. This is your bore diameter. Now measure the choke diameters with the Skeet's gauge. Subtract the choke diameter from the bore diameter and now you have the choke constriction. You can do the same with an eight gauge and the same tools.

Am going to keep her for sure.

I could have measured O/D and subtracted wall thickness to get bore but measuring was in the gun shop and limited to tools at hand., my buddy's Skeets and Mansion Gauge Left my Micrometers at home. Real test was dozen miles away at the gun club on paper. Am pretty sure the chokes have never been touched.

Shop must have taken in a lot of Ithaca's from the same person. Right beside it on the rack was a 20 & 16 all same engraving and I assume Grade. 4th Ithaca in the rack was a 12 Field Grade. Start a whole new collection right there if you wanted too.

I had been on the hunt for a Parker Hammerless 10 but this will fill the bill until the right one comes up. It weighs 9 1/4 lbs and seems to have more weight in the barrel than my 3 Frame Parker 10 G Hammer gun. Side by side the Ithaca's frame looks almost dainty next to the Parker. Will compare them side by side over the next few weeks. It swings nice.

Thanks to all that helped me with information. Not many places you can go for advice you can trust in a few minutes time

William



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Congrats on a great Super-Ten. That would make a great collection, a set of NID No. 1s in all bore sizes. Some time back, Steve Barnett had probably the hardest one to come by, this 34-inch barrel NID Magnum-Twelve No. 1E --

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...er/5001553.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...er/5001552.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...er/5001551.jpg

I've got the other tough No. 1 in my gunroom, a 28-gauge --

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...IDGrade101.jpg

Nice one Bill. Did you happen to notice the barrel lengths on the 16 & 20?

Ah how I lust for a (reasonably priced) Ithaca MAG 10 NID hopefully grade 2 :rolleyes:

Not a No. 2 but kind of interesting --

http://www.gunsinternational.com/ITH...n_id=100556271

That's a rather interesting gun as you say . And the price is a good bit more friendly then the one the guy in MI has .

The lack of safety I don't really care for but I could make do I suppose .

Daryl

The 16 & 20 were 28 inches, I don't know Ithaca's at all but do not think they were NID's . 20 was poorly re-stocked would not recommend it to anybody . 16 was a shootable gun not in collector condition though. Seems the Super 10 was used less than the others, if in fact they all came from the same place.

William

From September 1929 --

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...pszmszqro5.jpg

I was at a flea market over the weekend and there was a gun with a tag saying it was an Ithaca 10ga. I gave it only a cursory look because I have neither a need for nor an interest in owning one so I can't speak to condition or even model, and for some reason my mind never seems to go into "hey, maybe I can make some money on this!" mode. I do seem to remember it had the star engraving on the hinge pin. I thought about going back for another look having seen them discussed here and elsewhere; the tag said $800 I think. I expect you're all going to tell me I made a huge mistake?

we are all going to tell you we need the pictures you did not take

and

the serial number you did not write down


:rotf: :rotf: :rotf:

Got it. Maybe the next time the fleas are in town I can do a better job :rolleyes:.

My caution was I don't know Ithaca's at all. This exchange was valuable in figuring out what was what.

After I bought the Super 10 visiting Danny Patton's shop he showed me several older Ithaca's that had severe stock problems. He was repairing them but did say in his experence the NID is the one to have. Stock design is much better less likely to have problems

William