Just my 2cents......

To me a lot of the long range, super dooper duck crushers were merely marketing hype. Not that they didn't work. They worked well with the components available at the time. But they were developed in the era of softer shot using fiber wads and the new smokeless powder which was really in it's infancy. Todays offerings make these old duck crushers even more effective. But they also work very well in these old guns that were simply 30" or 32" field guns with choke constrictions starting around .030 and up. I've shot a boatload of ducks and geese with 2 3/4" loads and most of those with a 20ga. My 30" Fox SW is a great duck gun. Ask me how I know.

So to answer the OP's query; The definition of a long range shotgun to me is any gun you can reliably and cleanly kill birds within 40yds. The majority of hunters have no business shooting at birds 50,60yds or further.

There was a real nice half page chart in an LC collector association newsletter many years ago- I believe it was put together by Jim Stubbendieck - it breaks the total down by grade and options. I’ll see if I can find my copy Dave, It would be good addition to your ever growing data collection


Exactly Daryl, my earlier point

Nash Buckingham gave the Super Fox it’s reputation, but if we were honest, few if any of us will ever shoot like him no matter what’s at our shoulder

To Daryl's point. I live in what was once a pretty reliable crow flyway, in a small agricultural community in So. NV.
Me and my hunting bud were mad scientists, when it came to shotgun ballistics. Being avid hunters, and competitive pigeon shooters, we more than demanded proof. We tested everything, both on paper, and on actual birds.
One day we decided to test some loads on long range migrating crows. With my friend Chuck checking crow altitudes with a laser rangefinder, I would make, or attempt to make stupid-high pass shots at the passing crows. Guns used: An Ithaca Mag 10, and a Perazzi Pigeon gun with 35k and 40k chokes. We couldn't afford to have the NASA Space Agency confirm our findings, but the 12 ga was killing crows out to what we concluded was the lethal limits of the shot size, independent of the added payload of the Mag 10.
The max of the no fly zone was about 90 yards straight up.

Long range guns are wasted on me. I'm a very poor long range shooter. I don't take long shots except for the occasional 45 yard dove (and usually miss). I'm not good at estimating the distance of birds, and generally overestimate them. My shooting averages are good because of this, but I know I'm a fair shot at best. What counts for me is not wounding birds, and taking shorter, makable shots is my method.

Having said this, I still like the idea of those big guns, have a few, and bring them out on occasion to stretch my arms out some. Still, I keep hoping to find a nice, big gun, like the HE or one of those 3 frame Parker 12s. I admire and respect a good long shot, one who practices and can do it with regularity. It's just not me.

I'm really enjoying this thread and have learned much from it. Thanks to the posters.

I absolutely love using big, heavy long range double guns, for ducks, doves and the occasional turkey hunt. My 12/32" HE Fox, factory chambered in 3" length, weighs in at 9/8, as I recall, unloaded. My 12/32" 3E Smith is also factory chambered at 3" length, but not nearly as heavy as the Fox. I much prefer the big Fox with heavy loads for waterfowl. I also have a 3" chambered A grade Fox, 12/32", with a straight grip. I don't like it nearly as well as the HE with heavy loads.

I'm not a muscled up strongman, but I could never understand the obsession with lightweight shotguns for hunting. I have never had any problem chasing down a speeding woodie, or dove, with the big HE. I really enjoy trying to kill doubles (2 for 2) on ducks. With the heavy bismuth loads I use I just don't like the way a lighter weight double gun "jumps around" in my hands from the recoil of the first shot. Weight attenuates that a great deal, as does a pistol grip for me, which allows me to get on that second bird much faster and more accurately.

JMO, YMMV

Stan, a big, heavy, long barreled gun if fine for those birds you mention because you’re generally sitting or standing in one place and you don’t have to lug it uphill and down dale, across wooded and tangled slopes, through blackberry tangles and over blowdowns. Give me a 6 or 7 lb. Gun any say for this kind of work. I have a 9+ lb 10 gauge 3-frame D Lifter for turkeys if I want to use it but I’ll normally take my 12 ga. 2-frame 30” DH because it’s 7/12 lbs. I ofter sneak back into these covers before daylight and that’s over a mile in sometimes. That’s why I like a lighter gun.





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My Ithaca 10 Mag Is over 11 pounds and is a workout on a Fall turkey hunt. Most shots are aimed, but I did take a 57 step flying young turkey on the wing with it one Fall. Once you get it swinging, it keeps going, I will say that!

The world is a better place when there are some differences. This is a good example.

To respond to earlier questions, from the AH Fox factory records: 624 HE Grade
Super Foxes had 2 3/4 chambers, while 314 had 3 inch chambers, 8 were not recorded for a total of 946.*

A review of the pages within The Parker Story revealed precious little on the Long Range Parker,
and nothing noted in the index pages. My eyes are aging, so feel free to correct my limited research.
Lt Col Brophy's LC Smith volume covers the Long Range Waterfowl Hunter Arms
guns, but there is no mention of the reinforced lug splinter, as it has been termed
and is found on my 3 inch Long Range Smith.

This has been an interesting short study, and my appreciation is extended to all of the PGCA members
who have generously contributed to our knowledge of Long Range Parkers and other fine long range American double guns.
(I am still in search of a Long Range 3 inch
Parker and hopefully will discover one hidden in a small gun shop or left in a duck blind.)

{Mary reminds me that I was a PGCA member, N0. 905 in 2001-but disappeared for a good while after September of that year.
She graciously allowed me to retain that member number after returning to the fold relatively unscathed.}


* From Craig Larter's " The Super Fox 12-gauge Shotgun"; Winter 2011 Issue;
Double Gun Journal

Perhaps I'm too narrow-minded about gun weights. But, I don't think so. I can appreciate a lighter quail and woodcock gun, and have several of my own.

Just always seemed odd to me that so many men obsess over one or two pounds extra weight on a turkey gun, that they may carry a mile or more slung over their shoulder, but never complain about having to tote a 24 pound bird that mile back out.

Not all duck hunts are easy peasy walks in the park, either. I'm no stranger to hell-hole woodie ponds that require walking in through briar patches, devil vines, blowdowns and sharp beaver cut stobs that don't slow down punching through a set of waders.

Variety is indeed the spice of life, and I'm very glad so many people prefer lighter guns. They certainly have their place.

A good, and cheap, alternative to a Long Range Parker is a ten gauge with twelve gauge chamber inserts. Most wads seem to seal just fine in a .775 bore. An .800 bore, maybe not so much.