I must say you guys are absolutely amazing!!!! Thank you very kindly for the offers to help, but I could never accept such a gracious gesture. I have a meeting with Mr. Chadick at 2pm on Sunday to see what I am looking at as far as the restoration goes. We'll see and I will give you an update as the price he gives on the restoration.

You watch the movie Open Range theres a line from it shes going to give Kevin a locket and he says he can't she says something like you don't have any choice when its a gift. Darn good movie should of had a Parker in the line up. ch oh thoes silly pointers are great family dogs also sept for thoes little white hairs:eek:

Hahaha! You guys are too much! I'm truly humbled by this entire experience! God bless you all

My 2 bucks
 

Brik at 5 weeks. English Fox Red Lab.
2nd pic at 5 months and 50 pounds. Room in his skin for about another 40.
3rd pic at 7 months and 70 pounds. Greatest dog in the world.

http://i279.photobucket.com/albums/k...BRIK4weeks.jpg

http://i279.photobucket.com/albums/kk136/2low8s/020.jpg

http://i279.photobucket.com/albums/kk136/2low8s/037.jpg

3 pics = $6 Thanks for looking.

ABSOLUTELY ADORABLE!!!!!!! Thanks for sharing these.

I must say this post has set a record for the 2nd most pages ever issued, nudged out only by the Dead Sea Scroll! Jerry

Is that good or bad?

This has been a very good thread. Thanks all who posted.

That's a good thing Dee, it only shows the integrity of this board and the members. Anyone posting such a fantastic gun here would get good sound advice as guns like yours are cherished by all. The fact that it's a family gun is truly special. Keep writing, we enjoy the posts! No one here cares whether or not you know anything about double guns, it's the common link of Parker guns or any old guns that bonds many of us. I know I for one would really like to see what happens with this gun. Please keep us posted, Jerry

I'm very grateful to all of you. Every single one of you have given me some great advice. I appreciate all of the information and advice through here, where otherwise with me being ignorant to what I had and I could have possibly been taken advantage of by someone. Y'all have educated me enough to know what to do and not to do and I'm thankful and blessed to have stumbled across this site and have everyone accept me and teach me about this old Parker. Thank you cannot begin to scratch the surface for you guys. My hats off to you...please take a bow......:bowdown:

I'm of the mind that if the bores are salvagable that someone ought to step up and bring it back from the dead.Pictures often make the pitting look worse than it is and without someone looking at in in the flesh ,that does restoration, I would not be too quick to give it up as a lost cause.I'm thinking of the Optimus Lefever that sold last year that was given up for dead by many but was brought back to life.

I am going to have it looked at this weekend to see what kind of mess I am getting myself into

Just make sure that whoever looks at it is someone that actually does restoration and is someone that is on the "approved" list. Lots of guys out there that say they are "restoration experts" but couldn't correctly restore a hardware store clunker.Don't be shy about asking for references.Gun does not have to be made to look like new to be given a new lease on life and to seriously enhance the value.

It's Herschel Chadick in Terrell. He was referred to me by Bruce Day from here. I've heard very good things about him and he is closest to where I live. If someone from this site holds him in high regards, I will give him a go.

Mr. Chadick has certainly seen his share of Parkers but is not a gunsmith and I would take that into account when talking with him. He would certainly know of the men to talk to when it comes to doing any work on your gun.Just fixing the screws and cleaning the gun would add a lot and getting an evaluation of the condition with an eye to putting it back into shooting condition would be my first consideration.

I cannot for the life of me remember his gunsmith's name, but he is going to have him look at it as well. He is retired, but Mr. Chadick said he makes special exceptions for special guns. And my gun may be the case.....so I guess I'll see and take any advice that can be offered.

Dee, How close are you to Kerrville,Tx? Kirk Merrington is the best barrel man around and he hails from there. I have spent many an hour on the phone with him and he is a true gentleman. No one better to get an honest opinion from.

It shows to be a 5 hour drive from my place....too far for me :( Mr. Chadick's place is about an hour from me

I would liken this gun to a stage 4 cancer patient and suggest that you get a second opinion before doing anything,or not doing anything.High end gunsmiths are like top end doctors and some are more willing,and able,to take on the "hopeless" cases.The gun is important and deserves a chance if any chance is at all viable.

My visit with Mr Chadick is done. He said it definitely is a rare Parker (C grade with O frame). But will require a LOT of time to restore it...

What did he say needed to be done? This may be a second opinion idea.

I concur with brother Eric here.
 

Old bit of Chinese wisdom- if you want to know the true value of something you own, get the opinion of three non-related men who have no interest in buying it. Mr. Chaddick is a very well established gun dealer in Terrel, TX and has a good reputation, as does Jack Puglisi, Steven Cobb and other too numerous to mention here. However, I would also discuss this situation with Jess Brliley and also with Danny Clark of Collectors Firearms- both are in the Houston area. Mr. Chaddick is 100% correct in that the CH(E) guns are scarce, and the smaller sized frames and gauges may well be one reason for the value of your family Parker. The DH(E) or grade 3 numerically was not all that much different in engraving or stock checkering than the more costly CH(E), and was a bit like the fabled "red-headed stepchild" between the very popular DH(E) and the grade 5 BHE Parker, so there were not all that many manufactured. The late Ed Muderlak points this out in his book on the Parker- The Old Reliable and has some fine details about his visits and chats with Herschel Chaddick in past years. If you haven't yet read his writings, you might like to do so. And you are 100% correct about Bruce Day- if he makes a recommendation to you about guns and gunning, his advice is as solid as the Rock of Gibraltar!:bigbye::bigbye::bigbye::bigbye:

Said all of the etching needed to be redone, stock replaced, and barrels had pitting but is salvageable. :(

Dee: You have some excellant advice from Francis, Robert, Bruce & Others. I know Herschel and he is a gun dealer of integrity but not a gunsmith. I would show your gun to three qualified Parker smiths and get their full evaluation as to cost and results. Three who do not "have a horse in the race". You have a gun that is well worth restoration and for the money spent the monetary value would enhanced several fold. If folks on this forum are willing to chip in & help, your "better angels" should prompt you to accept. Once a restorer is selected and a price established any of us could send our contributions directly to him. There is nothing demeaning by accepting a little help from your friends,

IMHO Best Regards, George

Ok, Here is the contents of my research letter:

"It was ordered by J. M. Parisot in Palmetto Home, MS on April 8, 1904 and shipped on July 27, 1904. According to Parker Bros. Order Book No. 62 it was a CHE hammerless, 16-gauge. It featured Titanic steel barrels with a length of 28 inches. Its stock configuration was a capped pistol grip. The chokes were patterned RH full (185 # 7 pellets in a 30” circle at 40 yards) and LH full (185 # 7 pellets in a 30” circle at 40 yards). According to Parker Bros. Stock Book No. 45, its specifications were: Length of Pull: 14”, Drop at Heel: 3 ¼”, Weight: 6 pounds and 10 ounces. The price was $150.00 plus $25.00 for ejectors.

According to Order Book No. 63, the gun was returned on August 19, 1904 by J. M. Parisot to repair ext rib and frame. There was no charge."

I wanted to again say thank you to everyone here for their advice and knowledge. I believe I am just going to keep this old Parker and display it proudly. The restoration will have to come later down the road when I can budget in a cost of that magnitude. I am forever grateful to each and every one of you for all that you've done. You may not think you've done much of anything but give advice, but you've done more than you know.

Thanks for sharing with us, Dee!
 

I'll 'go out on a limb" here and state that the other PGCA members who responded to your thread here also appreciate your sharing the details of the history of your CHE 16 bore. I am also sure your Granddad (deceased) would be pleased that you are going to keep it as a family heirloom and keepsake.

I had a 16 gauge PH on the O frame with 26" uncut Twist barrels (grade 2) also made in about 1905 and I had it lettered. I am not a smaller gauge gunner, when I sold it having the letter authenticating it and the original factory barrel length was a plus in the sale transaction. I had shot it with the 2.5" RST 7/8 oz. loads, if I lived where there was both quail and dove hunting I would have kept it.

Your barrels being both full choke- not all that uncommon back in that era. Unless a specific pattern with a load was specified by the purchaser, Parker, L.C. Smith, possibly AH Fox- all tended to bore their barrels for full choke. This, in retrospect, IMO anyway, was a smart move, as later the owner could return the gun to the factory and have the chokes opened.
Unfortunately, there were some upland bird hunters with those fine older tighter choked Parkers who took a hacksaw to the muzzle area, in a mis-guided effort to provide more open shot patterns.

Again, IMO- if I were the fortunate owner of this CHE, I would have it restored (my choice is my friend Brad Bachelder in MI -about 25 miles from where I live)- I might have him open the choke on the right barrel, but leave the left one at full. I am 70 and not so "quick on the draw" and having a tighter patterning second barrel often stops a cripple or drops a wild flushing bird (if in fair range). The late Ray P. Holland had most of his upland double guns choked imp. cyl. right and full left.

Today's specialty shotshells (RST, Poly-Wad, Fiocchi, New Era, Hevi-Shot) have been a great bonus for those of us who treasure our days afield with a older fine vintage double, such as your CHE 16. Best wishes!!:bigbye:

If folks would review the posts, they will see that I recommended Hershel Chaddick to look the gun over, because he has sound judgment about how to make a Parker look good, and his retired gunsmith Tom Chapman to do the work if Hershel could convince Tom to take the project on. I don't think there was anybody better than Tom, although there were some as good, but not many. I know there are guns out there today that are believed original yet were redone by Tom. Hershel and Tom are close to Dee and that was an important consideration. Hershel is himself mostly retired, but still buys and sells a few guns, and people still call him with requests for certain guns.

There is no doubt that this gun is in, to put it mildly, terrible condition. Yet, Dee says that Hershel says it is salvageable, and I would bank on that. "Bank" is the operable word, because its restoration will be long and costly to do right rather than cobble something together. If Dee does not have the money and interest, this may be a good gun to sell to someone who does, and who will probably be upside down in the gun by the time they are finished.

Yeah, it 's in bad shape but we've all seen them brought back to useful life from dead.I would be of the mind that the gun should be "stablized" as soon as possible and if Ms.Durham would agree maybe this gun would be a good group project for the PGCA to take on. Document the restoration on video with narration to show what can be done by skilled and sympathetic restoration.Would make a good tutorial for the groups meetings.

Not to put to fine a point to it,but we're all familiar with an artifact ,be it an old car,antique furniture or whatever,in the hands of someone that is unable to conserve it quickly and fate steps in and the artifact is lost through circumstances beyond anyone's control. I speak from bitter experience and the time to act is always "Right Now!" Money is almost always the issue in these things as restoration is expensive and in this case ,as Bruce said,the expense will be more than the gun is worth at the present time.Take the long view that 20-50 years down the road someone will thank you for taking the plunge.

Althought the cost is too great for myself at this point in my life, I am not looking to sell it nor restore it to make money or a quick payday. Now, before my mother passed and I had mounting bills trying to help her with her hospital care then ultimately her funeral costs, I did in fact consider selling it because to me taking care of her was of most importance before anything. Somehow by God's grace I was able to pull myself together and take care of everything without having to go that route. I have the mindset that it is what it is and if/when I have the means and resources to restore it, I will but until then it will stay in my safe away from the elements and in worst case of never restoring it, I will display it proudly in my home and brag to my girls it's family history.

I value Mr. Chadick's opinion and am very well aware of his capabilities as well as that of his gunsmith Mr. Chapman. I, again, am grateful for the advice Mr. Chadick gave me, the conversation, and the quick history lesson on my Parker. He was very informative, and by all accounts a true gentleman. Thank you Bruce for your recommendation to him.

Please know, I am just happy that along this journey, I am glad to just have this adventure before me, grateful to the MANY new friends I have here, and am just all around blessed by everyone looking out for me here. I will take each step through this process gracefully and carefully. Who knows, one day I might be taking a picture of myself with this old Parker looking as beautiful as ever....only time will tell.

All in all...........I'm truly blessed by all of you, please know that :)

"Waaaay down the road indeed""
 

I have a suggestion. Normally I would contact a BOD or Life member privately re; this thought, but as both this little Lady from the Lone Star State has "barred her soul" to us about her personal loss of family members and the value of this well-worn 16 bore CHE once owned by her Granddad (and having been favored by my own maternal Grandfather re: a few good guns which I treasure)--If both the BOD and Dee agree, and she is willing to turn over this Parker to the custody of a nearby trusted PGCA member (Bruce Day if he is willing, perhaps) have it on the display table at the Annual PGCA meeting or the Vintagers- with perhaps gunsmith restoration expert Doug Turnbull using it for a seminar on both careful dis-assembly, and evaluation of such an older heirloom for restoration to using/shooting condition in today's mileu. And going one step further, use some of the funds from the Silent Auction to help her underwrite the cost.

We all have seen some possible 'trolling posters" on the open sector of our Forum, and I have always been charry of some of the things I have read on any internet web site that concerns itself with good guns. But I believe this Lady, and I commend her wish to keep this valued Parker. So many of us here (and on the other fine gun websites/forums) have been fortunate in the breaks that life sometimes puts in front of us-so the possible sharing of that good fortune with a deserving person merits some thought, at least IMO!!:bigbye:

You guys never cease to amaze me!!!! :bowdown: You're kind words and thoughtful gestures are truly a blessing. Thank you :clap:

I am still here and willing ! :)

I hope my information about the provenance of your gun and its early history was of interest and in congruence with the PGCA letter. I also hope that my suggestion to treat your gun as a piece of Texas and Louisiana history is of as much interest. Restored Parkers are a dime a dozen and are worth a dime on the ten dollar bill when offered for sale. Your gun is a wonderful example of Texas bird hunting history and should be kept as is. No matter what advice you get about rehashing your wonderful and rare bird gun, it is as good as it gets in its present condition. I, personally, will shed tears if this gun goes to the restorer. That's it for me. I tried my best.

You are quite welcome, M'am!!
 

-- If you ever get up to the Wolverine State, let me know and you can come with me to the gun range-if you like shootin' Colts- mostly 1878 SA Army "peacemakers", most of which my late father picked up while working on a dude ranch in Wyoming in the "dustbowl 30's" Unlike my maternal Grandad, who shot both Parkers and a hammer Purdey- all 12 bores, my Dad was an avid "pistolero" and also a deadly rifle shot. He got me hooked on woodchucks when I was about 10-I have both his two and only two shotguns- both older pre-War M12's (no doubles- most likely due to his heavy emphasis on rifle shooting I'd guess, in retrospect)-- I also have his 1939 MTWoodsman .22LR, his M70 SG in 30-06 he bought in 1939-1940- and his "house gun" a .38 Det. Special snubbie with hammer shroud. I like the Python in .357 full house loads, and the great 1911-A-1 Colt .45ACP for defense and target work--as Texan gun writer the late Bob Brister (Ace shotgunner) once wrote in his book: Moss, Mallards and Mules- about the words from his mentor Uncle Abner-"Man carryin' a big pistol most oftentimes not ever have to use it" perhaps Uncle Abner graduated from Teddy Roosevelt HS--

Anyway, IMO, the nature of our growth in the PGCA, our new increasing membership, the get-togethers and the great research done on Parkers by some very dedicated folks, all speaks to our success in what one might well call a "niche gun market"-- Many fine Parkers are sold or traded amongst PGCA members, and I applaud that- America's Finest Shotgun(s) should be in the hands of those who appreciate a top quality hand made well functioning shotgun from another time and era in American history. You might well say that we "keep the torch burning brightly" for futre generations, what the late sportsman and writer T. Nash Buckingham called "Our come-afters"--Best regards--:bigbye:

I would like to take a moment (and hi-jack this thread for a bit ;) ) to Welcome on board our most recent and newest PGCA Member:

Dee Durham


In the truest sense of "paying it forward", another PGCA Member stepped forward to anonymously sponsor Dee in this organization. To that fine gentleman...

Well Done, Sir...!!!

To Dee - Welcome aboard!!! Mary is preparing your welcome package to the PGCA....

:cheers:

John

:bowdown::bowdown::bowdown::bowdown::bowdown:

:clap: WOW! Just WOW! Whoever did this fine act of kindness....THANK YOU! That was very sweet, thoughful and generous of you! I really don't know what to else to say:shock: I appreciate you.

Dee: I hope you get this gun restored and would willing to contribute to that end. I don't know that much about why's and why not to restore a gun but have restored my share of auto's and was just trilled to death when done so could show them off and drive them. I have a parker that was restored by the Delgrego's and love it to death. Take it to the recommended restorers and get a price and lets get this show on the road. You can count me in for one Ben Franklin. Thomas L. Benson Sr.

Dee: I hope you get this gun restored and would willing to contribute to that end. I don't know that much about why's and why not to restore a gun but have restored my share of auto's and was just trilled to death when done so could show them off and drive them. I have a parker that was restored by the Delgrego's and love it to death. Take it to the recommended restorers and get a price and lets get this show on the road. You can count me in for one Ben Franklin. Thomas L. Benson Sr.

I really appreciate the offers to help from you and everyone else. I, like you, do not know about the why/why not to restore reasons either. When I originally posted here, I had not a clue of what I was holding in my hand, now that I do know what I have, I don't know what to do with it.....so right now I'm at the point of :banghead: LOL! I am genuinely grateful to each and everyone here and their willingness to help a complete stranger.