You have to let the gun recoil while being held in your hands to get accurate patterning. The gun recoils up and right and left before the shot leaves the barrels. All this was accounted for when they were made. They won't be regulated as well as a double rifle or an English best gun but they should be pretty good. Although I'm sure a few stinkers got through occasionally. And velocity and payload weight will change POI.

This applies to rifles too. Hold them how they'll be shot when sighting in. Shooting sticks, not holding the forend or fastening them to a lead sled changes POI.

To each his own. I have patterned every gun I own. I keep the patterns with a description of choke/shot size/ounces of shot/etc. I bought the lasers to see why the guns patterned the way they did. And the laser confirms it for me that they are not shooting to point of aim in many cases of guns choked that one would think would have great centered patterns. I can't think a Parker VH with .042 in each barrel would have been a 30 yard gun. Some guns do, some don't and almost none as the distance grows. With I.C. at 20 yards it hardly matters.

It does confirm that with a side by side, at greater distances the centers of the right and left will cross at some point and so will the vertical between the top of the rib and center of the bore. Each right barrel will go to the left at longer distances, and each left barrel will head to the right at distances beyond the regulated point, and almost all patterns are going to keep rising at the greater distances. So it could be the dove or goose I miss with the right barrel at forty yards shot behind him, and the left if I miss may be way in front of him and only bring feathers in each case. Thus why I shoot my A5s a lot better than my doubles.

Sorry I submitted this.

On the contrary! I found it very informative, I was going to pattern several gauges at 40 yds, just have not gotten around to it yet, Gary

Try patterning the guns with lead , TSS shoots different POI than leads loads in the same gun .

There is a good thread over at gobbler nation about it, search for a guy that goes by "poor country preacher"

Jerry, Thanks for submitting your post! I think it got us all to think more deeply about the regulation of shotgun barrels. I absolutely understand why you thought to use the laser since you were shooting your guns more like a rifle at non-flying game. That seems very appropriate.

I hope you continue to experiment...and keep us posted.

Thanks again!

I agree with Mr Gordon, your post is food for thought. I will be doing my own testing this week on my guns to see if at different distances poi changes. Thank you for your post.

Jerry, thanks for initiating the subject of barrel regulation. It brought out much of what I thought it might.

To answer a couple of statements.

When I shoot from the Lead Sled on a shooting bench I hold the grip and barrels/forearm just as if I am shooting at a turkey. The gun rises from the cradle when shot that holds it only for accuracy. The guns were not strapped down.

The loads were equivalent to high powered shells, 1 1/4 ounces in 12 gauge and 1 ounce in 20. So yes if the guns were patterned with say 1 1/8 and 7/8 with perhaps 1200 f.p.s. that may have made some difference. My thoughts were that guns extremely choked were built for longer distances, but if one shot them based on the belief that at forty yards they were killing machines, you would go home empty handed most of the time due to the pattern being way off at that distance. Faced with quick shouldering of a gun at geese or doves, even if it fits, one cannot remember to shoot to the left or right of a flying target based upon the pattern center.

i agree on your thoughts on how these guns sometimes just pattern terrible...charlie

I'm glad you brought up the topic of barrel regulation. However, shotguns are not pattern tested with lasers and a lead sled. That is for rifles. The resulting patterns are not reflective of how the gun shoots in your hands. There are plenty of pattern testing protocols you can google. I'd recommend following one of them and noting the results. You'll be standing, shouldering the gun as in the field and firing lead. This is why shotgunners spend or used to spend so much time and effort on fit. A shotgun may shoot for you differently than it does for others. Using lasers and a lead sled won't tell you much.