Beginning with the first serial number listed (158496 - all gauges and grades) from 1912 onward, I count 859 28-gauge Parkers made according to the 28 gauge table in the rear of Vol II of TPS. Certainly not all were on the 00-frame and we don’t and won’t know how many were on the 0-frame either but surely the 0-frame 28 gauge guns petered out, but there are a number of guns on both sides of 1912 that are not included in the data retrieved from the available factory records, antd that number is unknown but can be closely extrapolated from the known data.

Suffice to say that the 275 number might be correct if we extrapolate from the 253 28’s made to the beginning of 1912.





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Dean I had my doubts about that number, what would be your guess.

There is no way of knowing how many 0 frame 28ga. guns were made without physically looking at the guns and keeping a tally. I reviewed stock book # 75, which is the first stock book to list frame sizes. All the 28ga. guns listed were all 00 frames and all were in the 5 1/2 to 6.0 pounds except for 1 or 2 that had long barrels. Stock book 75 started at S/N 213778 July 1925.

But I have to ask, Why is it so important?

I would be comfortable with the 275 number but only to the beginning of 1912. After that point we really have no idea how many 0-frame 28's were made up to the date in 1934 that Remington Arms bought the Parker Gun operation.

There are also a few two-gauge, two-barrel (20/28) guns that were most definitely built on the 0-frame.





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Not counting 20/28 guns how many 0 frame 28ga guns have you seen that were built after say 1914. I myself have seen none.

I haven’t been watching 0-frame/date of manufacture guns.





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I can say one thing that can't be disputed. Joel's question to Mr. Del Grego was misinterpreted, or the answer was misinterpreted. Del Grego's answer had nothing to do with the question that Joel says he asked. I just counted forty four 28" 28 gauge V grade guns just up to 145,000 serial number, about 1907. Obviously there are more than 14 or 17 total. Joel, look in the appendix of TPS to get some better information. You could have looked at earlier entries in the SB if you were interested in 28 gauges made earlier than your 1902 gun. The numbers are there. I would also recommend that James Martin also use the TPS appendix for more and more accurate information.

By the way, there is no use in copying or recopying the stock books. Commander Gunther already copied them and we have the copies. What has not been done is to transcribe all the serial numbers in the stock books into the serialization book database. The information is there for Chuck to copy, anytime he gets a few minutes.

If the President gets the federal minimum wage up to $15.00/Hr, Chuck can get a $15.00 raise.

Bill ,I do look in TPS ,where are the 0 frame 28ga guns listed? That is what we were talking about.

Not true Bill. There is information that couldn't be copied at the right hand side of the stock books due to the limitation of the width of the copy machine. I would love to photograph all of the stock books, if I could.

Bless you Edgar!

Chuck, obviously I was kidding. However, these guys, Edgar included, should realize that all the serial number and barrel length and other basic information from the stock books is in the PGCA collection and doesn't have to be copied. It is already there.

In regards to overall weight, with configurations being identical, will a typical 28ga. 0-frame Parker Bros. gun weigh more or less than a typical 20ga. built on a 0-frame?

My 1902 VH 28ga with 28” barrels weighed 5 lbs 15oz from Parker if that helps.

I’ll have to follow up with Mr. Delgrego. He was very adamant about there being only 14 or 19 of this configuration made being as an 0 frame VH 28 gauge with 28”barrels.

When I questioned it being such a low number, he mentioned their large collection of Parker factory books they have and that he and his grandfather used to go back and forth on the exact number of this configuration being 14 or 19. Either way, it’s not a big deal but will be interesting to talk to him more about it and try to get some clarity.

It’s just a field grade gun in an early configuration but it is interesting to hear that Parker “potentially” ……..didn’t make a lot in this specific spec.



On another note this 1904 VH 28 gauge on a 0 frame with 26” barrels sold for 13.6k including buyers premium this past December.

https://www.rockislandauction.com/de...barrel-shotgun

Bill, I'm sensing you don't love me anymore:crying:
Maybe I should have said "Photographed" and not copied, because it was Chuck who pointed out that there IS (Despite your opinion to the contrary) valuable information which was not included in the 17" width of the copy machine, that could be added to a database if it could be accessed and PHOTOGRAPHED. You know, like with a camera?
I am not aware of any data in TPS which includes numbers of a particular frame. Maybe that might appear on the portion that didn't fit on the copier ?

Greg, I hope this is what you're after:
All 0 frames
28" 28ga. 5lbs 14oz
28" 20ga. 6lbs 1oz

24" 28ga. 5lbs 10oz
24" 20ga. 6lbs 3oz

The two 20ga. guns are DHE, the two 28ga. guns are VH, so ejector fore ends may be heavier than the two 28ga extractor guns. Also, the wood on the DHE may be marginally heavier due to density (?)

Yes Edgar, that was exactly what I was looking for, thank you. I'm a little bit surprised that the 28's are a little lighter than the 20's. When comparing weights of bi-gauge sets with the smaller bore barrels aboard usually make for a heavier gun. i.e. Parker Repro 20/16 & 28/.410 sets.

I own SN 173862. It is a DH 0 frame with 28” barrels. It was made in 1916.
I was recently invited to shoot pigeon and took this gun along with several other vintage doubles.
The Parker 28 performed very respectably with those 28” barrels. I missed some birds, but that was my fault. When I did my job I was tickled to see how 5/8 oz of 6’s and 7 1/2’s dropped these tough pigeons.
These is just something special about shooting passing birds with a 28 gauge.

I have attached a copy of the letter.

Phillip, does the letter say the gun was ordered with 2 3/4 inch chambers? I can't make it out. If so that may be why it was made on a 0 frame.

Yes it was ordered with 2 3/4” chambers. I had not given any thought to the chamber length before.
I did some quick research on E H Hotchkiss. I always wondered why this gun was in such high condition. It appears Eli died only 6 months after the gun was shipped.

As was usually done with Parker guns, the gun was chambered 2 3/4", probably for 2 7/8" shells. I didn't know that 2 7/8" shells were made that early, but maybe they were. They became the standard shell for 28 gauge until after WW2.

BHE 20 Ga-- 5 lbs 15.2 oz.
VHE 28 Ga-- 6 lbs 9.6 oz.

Both are configured the same:
30", Straight Grip, SFE, DT, O frame

Yours are more inline of what I was expecting. The BHE 20 must feel wand-like.

Randy, does your 28 have a beavertail, a set of Briley tubes, and a vent rib? Maybe you have Colonel Askins' 28 gauge.

No it does not Bill.