Skived indeed. I actually have one of those tools, just figured these were too far gone to fool with, didn't even try. Won't use skived hulls again, I thought that might make them EASIER to roll and result in less bulk at the roll. Most all of my hulls are unskived as I also load only 2 1/2". Appreciate the tip.

Here is my second try with the 4 pin roller...

https://i.imgur.com/61DBxvj.jpg

I made a hull trimmer with a dowel and a utility knife blade so I had a nice even hull to start with.
The first one i forced the shell in when the roller was still cold and I wasn't spinning it fast enough. Just pushed the shell into the roller with my hand. I then tried a few of the uneven cut cases that were hot glued in. They crimped OK and I had a mess of melted hot glue to clean out of the roller.
I will have to trim my cases somewhere between the two lengths i tried next time.

The first case i tried is the one on the left. I bent it over pushing to hard when I didn't heat it up enough. I tried it again after I did a few and got it to crimp down an little more.

https://i.imgur.com/GKqhYG9.jpg


So will my groups change after crimping VS just gluing in a shot card with the exact same load? I also compressed my FG black powder pretty hard with the 2 brown federal hulls. How much increase of pressure, if any, will I have with a hard pack? My crimp also looks more quare like the 1 pin BPI roller. Is it my crimper or did I just push to hard when crimping?

Cory, are you using a hand drill or drill press? It's essential that the hull be perfectly square with the crimping tool so that all four rollers contact at the same time. The old time hand rollers held the hull perfectly square to the hull also.
The only way I find consistency is using a hull vise, Drill press, with the quill stop set so that all hulls are rolled to the same depth.

I don’t own a drill press. I used a cordless craftsman drill and held the shell with my other hand. I varied the speed since the only way to regulate the RPMs is with my finger on the trigger. I kept checking the crimp till it looked even to my eyes. I’ll have to start looking for a drill press.

My 3 roll crimpers (10b; 12b & 16b) arrived from The Reloaders Network after an 8 day adventure with the postal service.

I use a MEC Supersizer as my hull vice, on my drill press. I get double duty out of it that way. Works perfectly.

Nice looking loads hard to improve on them

My take on the job, It has to be square & drill press only way I know to get it right. Actually I use the mill & made a 4 hull fixture. Clamp it in the mills vise and move the table to each hull. All 4 one set up. Mills not necessary just faster production. Sometimes I think about using the quill depth stop, feel on the handle is sufficient.

Small used inexpensive drill press will do the job. Cheap Chinese vise works fine. For a fixture drill hull sized holes in hardwood then split it into a clamshell fixture 3 or 4 hulls. Gap let’s it tighten. vise does not need to be clamped to the presses table. Slide it hull to hull. That’s what I did before going to the mill.

Having said that I fold crimp my short 10s on the PW press until the case mouths fail then cut shorter & roll . Shorter loaded hulls go to 1 oz # 8 loads

William

Thanks, might get a drill vise. Don’t plan on reloading a lot of them. I only have approximately 25 hulls right now and I don’t plan on shooting up factory ammo just to obtain more. My plan is to load a dozen or so at a time to use for turkey and predator hunting. Don’t want to spend an arm and a leg on reloading equipment and supplies for something I don’t plan on shooting a lot. My guess is my gun will be shot one to three times a year for turkey hunting now that my load has been dialed in. I will eventually roll a bunch out for my browning gold 10 gauge but no hurry as I have a lot of factory loaded ammo for it. Kinda hard to obtain hulls when I only shoot once or twice at a turkey each year and no one has hulls available unless your willing to get gouged on gunbroker.

Light volume you don’t need to multiple load like I do. Drill press is an advantage though. Drill press vise is useful for other things . Dedicated hull vise cost about the same and only useful on hulls

William

I took Edger's advise, bought the 4 pin 12 ga. model from Reloader's Network. Works like a champ, considerably better than single or 2 pin type. Left a perfect rolled crimp, nicely rounded on top. These were new 2 3/4" federal hulls cut down to 2 1/2". Went for the clear plastic overshot cards, no stamp required as shot size is visible. All the larger shot I load is bismuth.

Cory, for light duty gun related stuff the drill presses at Harbor Freight are fine. I bought a bench style one from them over 25 years ago, back when you had to order stuff and they shipped it all out of CA, and it's never missed a lick. Plenty strong enough for bigger jobs, I occasionally find myself using it for drilling up to 1 1/4" holes in steel for farm repair and fabrication projects, although I am now in the market for a bigger, stronger, floor model for my farm shop.

Hi Edgar, this is Nick Ross who makes the crimpers. Is there a way to private message you or email you. I can't find how to. Thank you!

Greetings Nick. I just shot you a PM. Look in the top, right corner, and you’ll seen the PM box. After you go there, you have lots of options from the menu on the left side of that page.
BTW, your tools have been a big hit and many of us have them.

Nick, in any forum or thread you can also just left click the username of the person you want to PM and select "send a private message to ***** ".

Hi Nick,
I got one of your crimpers when this thread first started back in January and I must say thanks for a job well done Sir!
I use it to crimp black powder loads in Cheddite pre-primed paper hulls and it works perfect.

Bruce

After Edgar pointed the way I ended up buying 4 of them. 10 ,16 ,20 , and 12. By far the best on the market, really nice results. I've got some barely used ones from BP and Precision for sale priced right!

For those who don't want the best? If you find someone who wants them, I have a bunch they can have too.

Thanks a lot! Much appreciated sir!

Wow, it's always awesome to hear these testimonials! Thanks! Really encouraging.

Thanks so much! Makes it worth doing.

Edgar, I figured I'd Ebay'em. You know, the PT Barnum theory. I'll bill them as "matched set, rare and hard to find", buyer pays actual shipping. It's either that or the scrap steel bin at the shop as I'll never use them again for sure. Never know, I might actually get my $$ back in hand! After the buyer fights with them a while and screws up some hulls Nick may get another sale.

By the way, when I was working my design out I didn't have paper hulls to try, so to hear it works on them is awesome indeed.

I’m gonna use my next Ross commission check to buy that AAHE 28 at Rock Island. :rotf::rotf::rotf:

Seriously, I’ve only recently “met” Nick, offline. All my blabbering on, was simply based on my opinion of the tool’s performance. My best ‘antique’ tool had 4 pins, and when I began using ‘that other guy’s’ single pin tools, it was one of those duh moments , which prompted me to search out a better tool.

Unknowingly, BP might be Nick’s best sales tool.

I finally got around to trying out my four pin roller for the 2nd time yesterday. Last, and fist time trying the roll crimper was last spring using a hand held drill. What a pain with the hand held drill. Never got them perfect IMO until 5 to 10 minutes of forcing the hull into crimper long enough to heat it.

So, yesterday I loaded up 9, ten gauge, 3.5” hulls for spring turkey hunting. All I had left unfortunately. I’m about out on x10x and Sp10 wads..and federal hulls….so I better take my time on the trigger with them. I headed over to my buddies house to use his drill press. It took about 3 to five seconds each to make a nice even crimp. I’ll be on the hunt for a drill press now. Loaded up 2oz of #6 NPI shot(only shot I have on hand) and 39 grains of HS-6 along with a X10x and SP10. I patterned it in my Browning Gold National Wild turkey federation semi auto 10 gauge along with a code black turkey choke. The load had more pellet count on my turkey head and neck target at 45 yards than any factory ammo I’ve tried. Just wish I had some #5 shot to try. I have have always preferred the #5’s for longer shots and better knock down. I brushed on some clear nail polish over the shot cards to waterproof them.



https://i.imgur.com/Qx8chmj.jpg

BPI has nickel plated 5s instock I ordered a bag 2 days ago.

I’m debating this drill press:

https://www.harborfreight.com/power-...ess-60238.html

I have that same drill press on my bench and it works great for roll crimping and other tasks in the loft.

It's slowest speed is too fast for 8 & 10ga. Barely slow enough for 12ga.

I have that press I bought when building my all electric homebrewing system. Except it was $69 a few years back. It ain't fancy, it's rather cheap, but I think it will work fine. I have not tried it on roll crimps but I'm not sure why a press would work better if the speeds are similar? Maybe I'm spinning too fast? Like I said, I just gave up. I'll try again tonight maybe on the press.

I use it for roll crimping 10, 12 and .410 and it works fine.

I’ll have check and see what kind of press I used the other day next trip over.

Edgar,
Can you share what speeds you would recommend??

I received my first roll crimp tools last week (16 & 20 ga), and I did a few 20 gauge with decent results but not great. Let's say, I will not be showing them off to you guys who are accomplished rollcrimpers:rotf:

Thanks for all the good tips by everyone.
Stan

I used my press last night, I think the slowest speed is around 1100 rpm. I did better than by hand, but a bit uneven and choppy. Of course these were previously 8pt crimped hulls so that's not ideal to begin with.

Ive had alittle luck roll crimping I just started a few months ago. I think roll crimping is one of those things everyone has their own tips and tricks that works best for them. I read the 16 ga reloaders say they get the best results 60-120rpms, but you're not going to find a drill press that slow most likely. I have come up with a few ideas to get a better roll but I havnt tested them yet.

Thanks for that info Milton,
I’m in search of an older drill press as we speak, have wanted to buy a general purpose drill press for my small shop for awhile now.
I’m looking for a good one��, if you know of one, let me know.
Stan

Stan, Given that the old hand crank tools were in use for paper hulls, I run my Rockwell press at 300 rpm. I'm using Nick Ross tools which have more pins than the common ones sold by either BP or precision.
The key to roll crimping plastic hulls is A) start with a smooth case mouth. If you're roll crimping 2 3/4" hulls, you already have enough extra to trim off, because the roll uses less than the star crimp. B) Heat. Start with a light pressure on the hull and withing a few seconds you'll feel it begin to roll, because the plastic is more pliable when warmed up by friction. Once its begining to roll, give it more pressure, and don't delay, because you can soften the plastic too much, and get crappy results.
I roll my 8ga hulls at a much slower speed, because the tool has six pins. I do them in either my Bridgeport with the back gears engaged.(I'm not suggesting you go out and buy a 2000lb milling machine) Anything more than 150-200 rpm and the tool heats up and scars the outside diameter of the hull.
Be aware of the tool temperature. I load up a tray with 25 or 50 hulls at a time, but don't roll all at one shot because the tool gets too hot. Rolling paper (I roll 12,16 & 20 paper also) heat doesn't seem to hurt the hulls but paper likes the slowest speed, or it scars, almost tears, the lip.
I've had many conversations with Nick Ross, and I will say, he puts a great deal of thought into his tools. To the extent, he is considering two different tools for 8 ga. hulls because of the hull thickness difference between Winchester and Remington industrial hulls. The 'smoothness' of the inside diameter of the finished roll is as important as the outside, and the internal tool profile takes hull thickness into account.
Cheddite paper hulls are thinner than Federals, and roll well with Ross tools, but I roll the Federal hulls in and old Deluxe Bridgeport Implement Co hand cranked roller.

Im thinking perhaps a easy way to do it is when roll crimping to just pop the driven pulley off and find something like one of these wheels and hand turn it. I noticed with my PR crimper it doesnt like any sort of lubrication in fact it wont even begin to crimp but the BPI seems to work either way. The above green hulls are 8 gauge Remingtons I did with the BPI cant remember if I used the drill press or hand drill. I have rolled crimped one old paper hull maybe from the 1970s with the BPI crimper with a hand drill. It worked but the old paper and the jagged way I cut the old crimp didnt look the best. I ordered some expensive custom paper hulls last week I might try something different crimping those they are to expensive to mess up haha.

If you wanted to get real simple id buy a hand crank drill attach it to a drill guide and do it that way. Really when you break it down you just need something that can hold a 1/2" chuck horizontally stable at a slow speed, I think anyway you could achieve that with a hand crank would probably work best. Or if these are just going to be used in a sxs or any break open gun run down to the local Dollar General and buy a hot glue gun or tube of duco cement. It really depends if you care how pretty they look you get better case mouth life using a glued in overshot card. Me personally I dont care as I get rid of them after 1 firing as I like my ammo to look pretty :rotf:

Thanks Edgar for your thorough explanation of how you do roll crimping and all the helpful tips.

And thanks to you also Milt, I appreciate all the knowledge I can pick up on this great forum.

As they say, Life is to short to learn only from your own mistakes, learning from other peoples mistakes is a plus:)

Thanks to this thread, the roll crimpers that I did buy are the ones produced by Nick Ross, so now the search for a good press will start. I love when I have an excuse to buy something that I've been wanting for a while.

Thanks again,
Stan

When I was old enough to take a gun out by myself, the only shotshells were paper, and loading paper hulls was initially my attempt to recreate the smell and nostalgia. I began rolling my own when I found a nice old hand roller. Since then I learned there's more to it, but, like Milton, I like my shells to look nice too.
Apart from the appearance, rolling gives advantages in lower pressures for old guns.
I've pattern tested lots of these, and found that overshot cards need to as thin as practical in order not to skew the pattern. or, doughnut hole them.
Another detail of importance is that the roll be physically uniform all the way around. If not, the mouth opens up first at the point of least resistance, and the pattern is skewed. The depth of the roll does not need to be any more than what it takes to do a complete 180 degree turn. More, and it builds pressure opening up the mouth; Less, and there's the risk the loaded shell will pop the card loose and spill the shot. Plastic hulls need reconditioning after fired. Reloaded paper hulls are never as pretty as they were new.
All I need now is time to get out and empty a mess of these shells.

Anyone using a “portable drill press” or “drill guide” versus a dedicated drill press? Ie one that you use a hand held drill in? Like one of these? How is your experience with them?

https://www.amazon.com/Milescraft-13...s%2C146&sr=8-3

https://www.amazon.com/BEAMNOVA-Benc...%2C146&sr=8-17