my old lifter 8 gahas stub twist barrels..what surprized me was that stub twist is stouter in strength than some of the other composite steel....the 20 ga lifter is sure nice do nt figure there s to many of them out there...charlie

Yes, on both accounts. Sat at my computer last night and did a bunch of reading on stub twist. It seems that it was considered tough stuff for composites. I love my pattern.
That 20 ga. is a gem. Have you ever fired your 8 ga.? Carl

While doing a letter, I found an order from 1880 that had 2 guns listed as Stub Twist for barrel steel. Can't say I've ever found another order that listed Stub Twist before. They were 12ga. guns, one with PG, the other straight grip, price was $65 and $60. Looking at the price list to determine grade, it would be the 3rd listing up from the bottom which says "Fine English Twist, no engraving or checkering. Went to the stock book and both guns are listed as T0. Looks like Parker considered any twist as Fine English Twist, except for Plain Twist.

One other thing, I thought Parker used Belgium sourced barrels so why would the call it English Twist?

maybe because it would sell better? Just as some Birmingham guns say London twist.

maybe - and this is pure guess- back then these were not origins - but patterns of the twist.

Wow, thanks for the great information. Can I ask you for your opinions? When I bought the gun, it had the mismatch...original walnut forend and restocked tiger maple stock. I chose to have it restocked with plain walnut, keeping the forend as is. My reasoning was that I was better off with the walnut stock than the maple. I have not done anything to the barrels or receiver. They are all original. My question, am I better off with a new walnut stock than a beat up maple stock. Appearance is much improved, but what about value?

Chuck, My gun is stamped T0!

Chuck, We know that Parker Bros. sourced barrel tubes from both England and Belgium. The English connection eventually faded away and Belgium became the primary source.


Carl, I think you are much better off with the replacement walnut stock.

Parker 8036 12 gauge 1876
 

I thought I had two w/o checkering but it seems I need stronger glasses. Here is the stock and forearm of 8036

Seems as though I remember someone saying that Stub Twist was made from horse shoe nails, I guess Drew could shed some light on this, Gary

Carriage springs were another ingredient I seem to recall seeing in a recipe for Stub Twist barrels.

Stub twist is the best looking of the Twist variations, IMHO. Unless you count Bernard as twist. A stub twist Parker is on my wish list for someday.

Yes your right. My limited readings suggests the nails were a good source of iron.
So does that mean they made a high quality twist barrel or just average. Thing is they seem to be kind of scarce.
My quest is more informational than anything else. One thing for sure, the pattern is bold, which I like.

Chuck, do the records show 10165 as having Stub Twist barrels?

It does....




.

Dean, anyway to guess on how many Stub Twist guns were made by Parker without research? I can't recall any listing in the Parker books of such information.

Carl, I suspect there is no way to estimate the number of Stub Twist guns made by Parker Bros. In the "Grades" section of The Parker Story there are tables at the end of each of the grades giving a breakdown of how many of each gauge/barrel length/barrel steel were made and only the tables for Grade 1 guns list any guns with Stub Twist barrels. 10165 is a Grade 0 gun and is listed as a T0 (Twist barrels, 0-Grade) gun and I believe the only 20 ga. lifter with 26" Twist barrels in the 0-Grade tables is probably 10165.

So, if 10165 is listed as a T0 gun I suspect a lot of other Stub Twist barreled Parkers have also been lumped into the T0 category with no reference to "Stub Twist".

Just my HO.

I'm not sure if this thread is still going, but I just read it asking about checkering (or lack of). If you're still looking for examples:

My Parker 12 ga. s/n 5670 says 'Plain Steel' on the top rib, and has no checkering on the stock.

# 5410
 

This is an early 20ga lifter. I believe the wood to be original

a lot of those guns listed as t o are in fact stub twist guns.. 1 of my 8 ga is listed as a t o in the parker bible but on the barrels it is listed stub twist....charlie