Truth be known, a LOT of the guns sold in London by respected "London makers" were actually sourced from Birmingham. Virtually all Westley Richards guns were.

And as stated above, a Best is a Best, as long as the craftsmanship is such. Geography aside. And I assure you that the precision of even an average Birmingham gun will astound most Parker or Fox owners. Proof? Just take a decent Birmingham gun to bits...

It's simple - We're old!!!

I don't think that anyone who knows anything about English guns would dispute that the Birmingham makers were all capable of producing "Best" work. Even their average quality guns were very well made guns. In fact the Birmingham makers had quite a long arm. Prior to the passage of the McKinley Tariff some were building guns for American companies and shipping them here. I believe that C.G. Bonehill was building SxSs for Colt and shipping them here.

I have a J. Venebles & Son 16ga back action hammer gun with a Jones underlever. There isn't much I have found on them and what I have found is limited. The only other one I have ever seen was a matched pair of hammer less 12's that Kirby Hoyt had at a shoot last year. It's a quality gun by any definition of the term.

What a wonderful configuration -- hammers, 20 ga. AND 30 " barrels! I assume Damascus? Got any pictures?

Have you seen Hadoke's new book, Hammer Guns in Theory and Practice? A great source of information (and opinion...he really dings Parkers, of course). Worth reading if you've got an English hammer gun.

Here ya go Garry. Yes they are damacus.

That's a beaut!! Thanks for the pictures. I really like back action hammer guns -- the original round action. The top of the frame is unique, a style I've not seen before. The really neat thing about many English guns by obscure makers is the quality of work that is frequently found.

Again, neat gun...thanks for taking your time to share those pictures.

Wm. Ford is not that obscure. I've seen/handled a number of Ford guns. This one is very nice as a 20-bore. And... hopefully you'll find a cap screw for that right hammer before shooting the gun. Otherwise, that hammer WILL loosen and fall off.

Daryl's gun is even better in person--and he shoots it well. .i have a liitle J. Manton 20 ga hammer gun( Belgian) w/ 30" twist barrels and it is my. favorite gun to shoot sporting clays with--and I have taken several limits of grouse and pheasants with it also