As he often does, BD makes a valid point. And comes very close to the crux of the issue: Equating cartridge length with "power" and potential over-stress of the barrels.

Neither is necessarily the case.

A 2 1/2 inch cartridge can be just as effective as a 2 3/4 inch. In fact, the extra 1/4 or so is simply there to accommodate the crimp fold. BD's photo shows this.

And, as has been flogged out many times on this board, Sherman Bell has long since proven through scientific tests that this extra 1/4 inch of case has virtually no effect on chamber pressure.

Thus, lengthening a Parker chamber is virtually pointless. And might even be dangerous.

(But Bachelder would NOT do "dangerous")

Just a follow-up question on RST spreader loads. Do they really enlarge the pattern by about one choke? I have an original 20 ga. DHE w/ full chokes and would like to use it on woodcock, but do not want to open the chokes. Will spreader loads improve the patterns over the regular 2 1/2 loads?

Thanks ......Jerry

It's my understanding that the spreader loads will open your pattern about one choke size for example full to mod but the only way to know for sure is by patterning them. The length of the shell should make no difference.

Buy a box and see for yourself. People can have all kinds of opinions and all sorts of advertising statements that do not last beyond the first trigger pull.

But the difference between full choke and cylinder bore at 30 yards is five inches radius ( each side) for an effective killing circle for a game bird. If your aim is off, a broader pattern will not truly help you. On the other hand, if the problem is that you are centering the bird and making mincemeat out of it, why not change to a lesser charge? A good shot can use a full choke gun and hit the head and neck of a pheasant or duck, that will kill them dead in the air The problem with full choke and small birds is that it hits them too hard .

If you are shooting clays only, it doesn't take much to break the target and you don't worry much about a killing pattern. There the broader the better but for holes in the pattern.

Some of us do enough shotgun instruction to see that most misses are by a matter of feet or even yards, usually not enough lead on a crossing target. Fine tuning the shot pattern size will not cure a miss of three feet.

Back in the early 1920s, when Western Cartridge Co. introduced the use of progressive burning smokeless powder and high velocity shotshells with the introduction of their Super-X loads, their new 20-gauge 1 ounce load was put up in their 2 3/4 inch FIELD shell. Most of our other North American ammunition companies followed and put their 1 ounce progressive burning powder 20-gauge loads up in a 2 3/4 inch case, Remington Nitro Express, Peters High Velocity, etc. Winchester, possibly because they had many customers out there with their 20-gauge Model 12s made for 2 1/2 inch shells offered a choice --

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...pscklbp1xn.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...psschifisq.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...s33ba39bc.jpeg

These are both roll crimp shells. The pie crimp was introduced by our North American manufacturers in the 1938/9 time frame on their Trap and Skeet loads, but didn't begin appearing on hunting loads until after WW-II.