NO!

Rich,
You are on target with those gun and especially choke choices. We differ only slightly with gauge preferences. I love those open chokes for the early season alders.....there's nothing like ruining the resale by opening chokes to make a gun perfect!
Best Fishes,
Steve Kleist Ely, MN

This particular Day ,This One !:)

Of course it is!

Steve I haven't opened the chokes on any of the guns mentioned. I'm sure the chokes were opened on the DHE 20 at CYL/CYL but I didn't do it.

Ok, I'll weigh in on a subject that is as difficult to nail down as what to look for in the perfect woman.

I will not use the term balance because it is misleading. To me, the most important aspect is the dynamics of the gun. I like a piece with a bit of weight but with most of it between the hands. The weight smooths the swing and tames muzzle jump. A dynamic gun will feel much lighter than it actually is. It will come to the target smoothly and smooth equates to fast. And, since I like to practice quite a bit with my grouse gun, weight very much tames recoil.

I've had the pleasure of shooting many different so called grouse guns. Very few have qualified. Passable yes, but ideal no. I have no bone to pick with the 28 ga except the cost and availability of ammo and their excessively light weight. Most I've shot had more perceived recoil than my 12's. The 12 is just overkill for grouse but if I had one with the right dynamics I would not hesitate to use it. The 20 has everything going for it. Ammo , reloading components, and empty hulls are easy to find. There is enough weight but not so much that an old guy like me cannot carry it all day.

After many years of looking and trying different guns I found what I consider ideal. It is a Parker repro 20 with 26 inch barrels that weighs 6-12. It has double triggers which I consider ideal for skittish grouse over dogs. Switching barrels is instant and without thought. I had the ckokes opened to .004 and .008. The tight barrel will break clays hard to 30 plus yards, about the max I will shoot at a grouse. The factory Q1/Q2 would make an ideal combination but I could not find one when I was in the market to buy.

This is my dedicated grouse gun and my only wish is that I had it 40 years ago. While it is, in my opinion, an ideal grouse gun I have used it quite a bit for doves as well. I've shot more doubles on doves with this gun than any other. Two years ago I managed 3 doubles in a row. There is no amount of money that would get me to part with it.

At the end of the day all that I can say is I am glad it's easier to find the perfect woman than the perfect grouse gun and it's a hell of a lot less expensive (relatively speaking, of course).

I've beeen watching this thread with interest. I have many good grouse guns, but not the perfect one yet. I have Setterman's perfect gun-- an O frame 16 DHE w/ cyl/mod chokes, and st. grip, but the damn thing is too short (13 7/8 lop) with about 3" of drop. This year I am going to shoot a VH 20 w/ 26" cyl/m @ 6 lbs even. It hasnt been carried since 1990 when I tripped on the only piece of barbed wire I have ever seen in the woods in the UP, and broke the stock. My Vh 1 frame 16 has been my goto grouse getter for many years-just wish it was a few ounces lighter. Also have some Sterlingworth 16's and 20's that have to be carried a few days a year.
Not a Parker, but a little grade 2 Ugartechea 20 at 5 1/2 lbs went 11 out of 15 during my last 3 days in the UP last year.
Truth told, I would hunt with my old Iver Johnson single shot 30' full choke 12 as long as I could hunt over my dogs(setters).

Harold ,Nice picture , isn't it amazing how much a Dogs ear will bleed when stuck with a Heavy Briar or crab apple !

yeah Harold

I am glad to see other setters that are as thrilled to pose as much as mine :rotf: