Magnum loads

[steveulrich]

Just wondering if it is a good idea to shoot 2 3/4'' magnum loads occasionally out of a 12 ga Parker with titanic steel barrels. I would normally use trap loads in a antique, but thinking of going after a gobbler with it. What do you guys think.

[scott kittredge]

i wouldn;t just because the stock takes a pounding, pick up a 10 ga, scott

[John Hancock]

Ed, I am 67 and have been plagued with turkeys on my farm for years. I call them Hoovers, ie.vacuum cleaners, they get into a field and eat up lots of grain intended for the dove and quail. Over the years I have shot at least ------, well lots of them with anything with .030" of choke and regular 1200 fps 1 1/8 oz. of 7 1/2's. Usual shell is the Rem STS Light Handicap. At 45 yds. or less just put the bead right under the head I'll have holes all in the head and neck. At 25 yds. a lot of the head goes away. Don't know how close you hope to shoot one at but you might draw a head and neck on a piece of cardboard and see what your gun will do. The density of 7 1/2's out of a good shell is really something. Something to try. JH

[Richard Flanders]

"Plagued with turkeys"...!? Poor guy!! I think we better have a party weekend at Johns and help him out guys!! Would that be fun or what?!

[Paul Plager]

Richard, I'll race you to see who gets there first.:rotf:

[charlie cleveland]

ed i dont think a few of these shells through that old parker will hurt her...but as said a ten is better...im shooting 3 1/2 inch 12 ga through my old ten ga parke r for turkey...it aint hurt it yet...yep its twist steel... charlie

[steveulrich]

Thanks for all the good ideas. Charlie, I have not heard of that before, how do you accomplish 12ga in a 10? Is there an insert? Can I shoot 20ga in my 12ga the way you do?
Twist barrels Im sure is done to death on here before. Is there a bare bones basic on which twist barrels can be shot? My old Daddy told me you can never shoot twist because bad stuff (acid?) can seep inside from old time powder and cause deterioration. Since many guys shoot twist he was wrong. Are other brands weaker than Parker? What is the magic formula?
Thanks again. Ed

[Mark Ouellette]

Gentlemen,

Please know that the SAAMI specification for 10 gauge 2 7/8" and 3 1/2" loads pressure is 11,000 psi.

The SAAMI 12 gauge 2 3/4" and 3" pressure is 11,500 psi.
The SAAMI 12 gauge 3 1/2" pressure is 14,000 psi.

That extra 3000 psi is 36.6% over 11,000. The surface area of a 10 gauge compared to a 12 gauge is 9% larger so potentially there may be a 9% pressure drop but I have no data to prove this. Even if it would only be a 27% gain in pressure that doesn't seem to be safe.

I believe that one can do as they chose so long as it does't hurt others but...

Charlie if you blow off a finger or two you'll type worse than you do now! It is hard enough to read your posts now since punctuation escapes them! I do however try to read them because they are full of good wisdom. :) Please do not endanger any of your typing fingers...

Let's be careful out there!
Mark

[Bill Anderson]

Just wondering if it is a good idea to shoot 2 3/4'' magnum loads occasionally out of a 12 ga Parker with titanic steel barrels. I would normally use trap loads in a antique, but thinking of going after a gobbler with it. What do you guys think.

You should try RST's premium grade 2 3/4" pheasant shells with 1 1/4 oz of 5 or 6 shot. I have fired them in #6 shot through my D grade damascus Remington 1894 12 gauge with 6" of choke constriction (.037) and the pattern out to 45 yards is just unbelieveable! Box of 25 is only $11.00.

Bill

http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y480/TommyGunsNo1/rstpremiumpheasant6_zps6feb4c66.jpg
http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y480/TommyGunsNo1/rstrightbrl40yd_zps35096d15.jpg
http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y480/TommyGunsNo1/rstleftbrl40yd_zps082fc8bf.jpg

[Eldon Goddard]

Charlie your got me scratching my head on that one. Does the 10ga have a 3 1/2 in chamber your shooting this 12ga 3 1/2s through? About the craziest thing I ever seen was my cousin shot a 38 special through my 300 win mag. Checked the gun over and could not find anything wrong. I have shot the gun for years after with no problem. I can only guess that the soft lead .357 bullet compressed itself through the .308 barrel.

[Richard Flanders]

Eldon: He prolbably has a pair of 12ga "gauge mates" inserts fitted to the gun.

[charlie cleveland]

to answer you boys question on the 10 ga shooting the 12 ga in it...i use a chamber adapter called gauge matesit allows the 12 ga shell to fit the 10 ga... yes you can get the gauges mates in many differant configurations like the 4 ga to 8 ga and 10 ga...8 ga to 10 ga and 12 ga.. 10 ga to 12 ga to 20 ga... 12 ga to 16 ga 20 ga to 28 ga to 410 ga....the list goes all the way down to the 28 ga....and they make custom gauge to fit anything you want...my 10 ga patters very well with using the gauge mate in the 12 ga set... these gauge mates are not very costly the cheaper ones are about 37.50 each...thanks big ten for showing the presure of the shells...im sorry for my typing i have tried to do better but heh im what i am a bad typer.... no offence meant ... i m not telling everybody to go out there and fire magnum loads through there guns with any parker barrel but i know my old gun as withstood heavy loads for 30 years or better...no barel problem and no stock damage...in my opinion i think these old barrels are better than we give them credit...only barrels i ve blowed up were fluid steel barrels on a 28 ga... mr bell tryed to blow up these old barrels and he did some of them but he had to use way above the sammi pressures given above even these modern mag 12 ga loads...ok fellows im out on a limb so dont think the less of me..ha charlie

[Mark Ouellette]

Charlie,

No offense taken. I figure that you are doing your best. I just don't want your typing to get worse! :rotf:

I think the same that composite barrels are stronger than conventional wisdom professes. My theory is that composite barrels are more elastic than are those made of fluid steel. That said, I do err on the side of caution with them.

Mark

[Larry Mason]

I turkey hunt with a 20ga. Either my GHE Damascus or my Trojan. I have been using RST 4s & 5s. They work great up to 40 yards!

[Larry Frey]

I turkey hunt with a 20ga. Either my GHE Damascus or my Trojan. I have been using RST 4s & 5s. They work great up to 40 yards!

That makes two Larry's killing turkey's with a 20 gauge. The bird in my avatar fell to a load of #6 at about 30 yards.

[tom tutwiler]

You should try RST's premium grade 2 3/4" pheasant shells with 1 1/4 oz of 5 or 6 shot. I have fired them in #6 shot through my D grade damascus Remington 1894 12 gauge with 6" of choke constriction (.037) and the pattern out to 45 yards is just unbelieveable! Box of 25 is only $11.00.

Bill

http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y480/TommyGunsNo1/rstpremiumpheasant6_zps6feb4c66.jpg
http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y480/TommyGunsNo1/rstrightbrl40yd_zps35096d15.jpg
http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y480/TommyGunsNo1/rstleftbrl40yd_zps082fc8bf.jpg

Just curious, any idea on the pressure of that load? I know RST is pretty good at providing info. I'd see those as nice turkey loads or even nicer pheasant loads out west where the shots are long and the wind always blows.

[Eldon Goddard]

I like the way Charlie writes. It is stream of conscious writing like in Ulysses. So I take no offense at all.

[Dennis V. Nix]

My grandmother used to write the way Charlie writes. She made many a cheery pie from the cheery trees growing in her back yard. I appreciate it and have no trouble with it now that I am used to it. I sometimes have trouble with people who are as old as I am (67) who don't know barrel from barrell, there from their, don't use past tense such as useD to know or I supposeD the pheasant was farther away. But having said all of that I know people probably read my writing and think to themselves, that Dennis doesn't know anything. NAHHHHHHHHHHHH. We are all different and that is what makes us special. As my wife would say, stop rambling.

[Bill Anderson]

Just curious, any idea on the pressure of that load? I know RST is pretty good at providing info. I'd see those as nice turkey loads or even nicer pheasant loads out west where the shots are long and the wind always blows.

Alex Papp at RST just answered the pressure question I gave him yesterday on their 12 gauge 1 1/4 oz pheasant loads .
It is 7500 PSI

Bill

[Pete Lester]

Magnumitis is common affliction that is contagious and wide spread amongst shotgunners. Bigger, longer, heavier is supposed to be better (but in reality it's not). When most Parker's were new what kind of loads were they killing Turkey's with? Were the old timer's under gunned? I don't think so. A one and quarter once 12ga load was the magnum load back in the day. It was the heavy load in 10 gauge for many years. They killed a lot of stuff.

Look at the patterns those RST shells threw! Would the turkey be any more dead with a heavier load? When we choose to shoot classic shotguns we should also choose the loads they built for IMO. Parker's have wonderful regulation and patterns with the right chokes. Be careful not to catch Magnumitis, it is a painful condition for one's shoulder and prized double guns.

[wayne goerres]

I agree with mr Brooks. No point ruining a nice gun. And I would be surprised if a 9 percent increase in barrel translates in to only a 9 percent decrease in preasure. Changes in bore size are rairly proportional. I believe after the wad leaves the chamber mate it no longer makes a seal in the 10ga bore and the preasure drops drasticly. If Iam wrong I am sure bsomeone will correct me.

[Mark Ouellette]

I use Gage Mates often. Modern 12 gauge plastic wad seal good in a 10 gauge barrel.

[tom tutwiler]

Alex Papp at RST just answered the pressure question I gave him yesterday on their 12 gauge 1 1/4 oz pheasant loads .
It is 7500 PSI

Bill

Sweet, I'll be shooting those out of a number of my older Parkers at Turkey's, as well an old Fox or two.

[Daryl Corona]

Pete has hit the nail on the head. I have yet to find a bird (including turkeys, ducks and geese) that can't be cleanly killed with a 1 1/8oz. trap load of hard 7 1/2's. I know many will disagree but to me the real sport is to decoy the birds in to under 35yds. and with a wonderfully full choked Parker or Fox then center the pattern on their neck/head. Thump... bird down. If the bird won't respond to my calls and decoys then he wins that day. I don't own a 10ga.(yet) but when I do I'll bump up my payload to 1 1/4oz.- 7 1/2's. Everything being equal (shot size, velocity and choke constriction) there is roughly an effective increase of 5 yds. for every 1/8oz. increase in payload up to 40yds. or so. After that it's a crapshoot. JMHO.

[Destry L. Hoffard]

I like a heavy load for waterfowl, but I'm prone to shoot at them a little further than 35 yards at times.

A friend and I do some nuisance shooting on a farm down south and sometimes the birds are very high. When you get in the groove you can kill them 70 yards plus with the right gun and load.

When I'm doing this kind of work, I either use the Parker 10 gauge magnum with 2 ounces or an Ithaca Mag 10 with 2 1/4 ounces. Just depends on how many rounds I think I'm going to have to shoot in a days time. The Parker is mighty hard on the shoulder even with the 2 ounce shells. The Mag 10 will kill them further than the Parker I'm sad to say, and is much easier on the body.

I'd love to take somebody down there shooting 1 1/4 of 7 1/2 and see how much damage they do.


DLH

[scott kittredge]

I like the way Charlie writes. It is stream of conscious writing like in Ulysses. So I take no offense at all.

his writing looks fine to me, i under stand it perfectly fine, so i am not sure if thats a good thing or bad:rotf: :shock: keep it coming, scott

[Daryl Corona]

Destry;
I was referring to the good ole' days when we could shoot lead and we would shoot little creeks where our farthest shot would be 40yds. I'd never attempt a 70yd. shot with that load. I will soon have a 10 ga. and then let's see what it will do at 40+ yds. on them wary honkers.

[Destry L. Hoffard]

I shot some decoying ducks with #7 bismuth during this past season. Loads were 1 1/4 ounce, they seemed to kill them fine if they were inside 30 yards but any further and it was cripple city. I've never been a big fan of the Bismuth Cartridge Company loaded shells and that's what they were so that might have been the problem.

DLH

[Daryl Corona]

I agree. The Bismuth loads did'nt pattern well and the shot was very brittle. They really did'nt transfer their energy into the bird. I'm a big fan of Nice shot for reloading and Tungsten Matrix in a factory shell. The #5's are deadly. Nice, dense pattern and plenty of energy. Boy, to be able to shoot the old lead loads again. Those were the the good ole' days.