Proper measurement of stock dimensions

[John Mazza]

Is there a specific "standard method" to measure stock dimensions ? Specifically, drop at comb (DAC) and drop at heel (DAH).

Here's how I measure them: Using a straight metal ruler, I lay it NEXT to the front bead, along the top of the rib. Then I measure the perpendicular distance from the ruler to the front-most part of the comb (for DAC), and then do the same at the "spur" on the Parker buttplate (for DAH).

Is this "right?" My letter claims my Parker has a DAH of 2 7/8", but in order to get that measurement, I need to measure it approx. 3/4 of an inch forward from the buttplate spur.

What is the proper/standard way ?????

Thanks guys !

John

[Chuck Bishop]

That's the way I've always done it. LOP I use the front trigger to the middle of the butt. Interested to see what others say.

[John Mazza]

Thanks. I've heard that length of pull should be on a line parallel to the line of sight (the ruler). IE: Not the direct distance from front trigger to the middle of the buttplate. As a result, the "proper" way will be a tiny bit shorter than the "direct line" measurement. (But either way probably yields a VERY similar result...)

Others ?

[Rick Losey]

length of pull is from the front trigger to the center of the buttplate/pad

your DAC and DAH are the best way without a specialty guage


example
http://www.lcsmith.org/faq/stockdimen.html

IMHO the drop at your cheek point is really the one that matters - that is where your rear sight aka eye goes

[Dennis V. Nix]

I don't have a measuring gauge so I simply lay the gun (double barrel) upside down on a flat table. I measure from the comb of the stock to the table and then the end of the butt stock to the table. For length of pull I have never seen anything but measuring from the front trigger to the middle of the butt plate. I agree with Rick that the one that matters is the drop at comb. As your eye is the rear sight that gives the most important impact on your ability to hit what you aim at.

[Drew Hause]

1952 Purdey catalog

http://pic20.picturetrail.com:80/VOL1373/6511424/20113938/390824000.jpg

[Brian Dudley]

Dennis,

That is usually how I measure drops as well. Upside down on a flat surface. It is important though to make sure the sight bead is off the edge of the surface, since it can effect the measurement by quite a bit.

I too have noted a couple of original Parker's that the actual dimention measurement was a bit off from order records. Maybe by 1/8" or so.

Actually, I think that depending on the gun, the method of using the ruler extension off the rib is more accurate since if the rib is concave, it will give a different measurement than resting on a table. But, unless the rib is a French swamped style or something, the difference in measurement will be very little.

And the actual point that you measure at makes a difference. As you say, the measurement at the tip of the heel could be different from the dimension at the spur.

[John Mazza]

Thanks guys - that Purdey chart certainly spells it all out ! I'm always surprised that I seem to shoot guns with more drop better than "typical" (modern) drops. I have a modern gun with 1 1/2" & 2 1/2" drop, and I don't shoot that as well as my Parker hammer gun with approx. 1 3/4" and 2 7/8" drop. (I'm only 5'-8" if I'm wearing shoes, so I would think I wouldn't need much drop or length of pull...) My cheek hits the stock approx. 6" back from the front trigger, so that's where I like to measure in order to compare gun "fit." Most of those old English guns have so little drop - how in the world did anyone hit anything with them ??????

[Bruce Day]

If you are trying to measure a Parker, Parker catalogs at the back give specific instructions for measurement.

They also provide standard stock dimensions for those curious.

[Drew Hause]

This helped John, but was hard on the aligner-fella :shock:

http://pic20.picturetrail.com:80/VOL1373/6511424/21690841/398083445.jpg

[Gerald Majors]

Where can I down load That copy of the Purdey Stock measurement form to print for a refference sheet?
Thanks
Gerald

[Drew Hause]

Gerald: David Trevallion sent me that image scanned from the 1952 Purdey catalog.

Check p. 408 in Greener's The Gun

http://books.google.com/books?id=3HMCAAAAYAAJ&q=stock+dimensions#v=snippet&q=stock%20dimensions&f=false

[Tom Kidd]

Hello Gerald, Let me know, if you can't come up with the measurement chart, I am pretty sure one of my packed away Purdey Catalogs will have a copy/info that I can scan for you. Tom

[Mike Poindexter]

Upside down on a granite island top, with the front bead off the edge, always does the job for me. For a surprize, try lining up three or more guns at the same time and sight down the long axis from the butt ends. Small amounts of twist and cast become apparent that aren't readily noticeable looking at one gun only. Look across the guns at the buttplate and you can see the differences in pitch. Then you realize why some guns just seem to fit better than others. Best.

[Daryl Corona]

John;
I have a couple of english guns and yes they are stocked pretty straight with very little drop at heel. They shot mostly driven, overhead incoming birds and those dimensions allowed for a better view of the bird with a built in lead. Just my theory.

[Kevin McCormack]

In copying the c. 33,600 individual sheets of paper that made up the surviving Parker Gun records at Ilion in 1999, I doubt we ever saw more than 1/2 dozen Order Book notations that gave all of the classic 3-way measurements for a 'true' custom stock-dimensioned LOP; e.g., heel, midpoint, and toe lengths from the trigger.

Drew's Purdey chart via David Trevallion shows how it's done 'to the max', so to speak. Subtle differences recorded in precise lengths and angles to the shoulder and breast muscles are recorded and duplicated in the best fitting stocks, especially in women, including cast on or off, down- or up- pitch, and, in the case of the middle measurement, "yaw" taken into account in how the person mounts, shoulders, and cheeks the gun at the "moment of truth."

For an easy, visible example of how production guns are compensated for the above variables, just look at a diehard trapshooter or sporting clays fanatic's stock fitted with one of the modern "twist and shout" adjustable pads. ('Twist' as in "I'll smoke his butt" next time and 'Shout' as in "Damn! I missed it again!!")

[Paul Harm]

John, you'll find if you put more weight on the front foot you'll be leaning forward with your head " stuck out " and need less drop in the stock. Now if you stand more upright with the weight equal on both feet your head will also be in the natural position - " up right " - and you'll need more drop. Of course, you can't lift your head to see if you hit a clay because your head is already up. All my guns have 2" DAC and 3 1/8" DAH. Try leaning forward like a modern shooter and all you'll see is the receiver. It's all what style you shoot. I shoot gun down and stand upright. A lot of drop fits me. Paul

[John Mazza]

That makes sense. I do tend to shoot with equal weight distribution & my head in a more upright position - no wonder I like more drop. Plus, I think I tend to lift my head - so if it's already "up", I can't lift it much more !

Thanks to all who commented on this string - I appreciate it !