Looking for 8 gauge info

[Chuck Bishop]

I'm looking for some information on Grade 2 hammerless 8 gauge guns. These guns, made between 1889 and about 1910, were called "Quality EH" in the price lists. Parker didn't sell GH's in 10 gauge, they made them in the EH grade which was equivalent to the GH but at $5.00 more. For the EH grade in 8 gauge they tacked on an additional $35.00 charge plus, in some cases, an additional charge for extra long barrels.

My question is; does anyone have a Grade 2, 8 gauge gun manufactured between 1889 and about 1910? If so, how is your water table marked, GH or EH? I'd like to get as many responses as possible.

Thanks,

Chuck

[Bill Murphy]

Not to say water table markings can't be all over the map, but the EH is restricted to 10 gauge guns. The 8 gauge, according to catalog information, is a GH. The 8 gauge Grade 1 was also considered a PH when the 10 was an NH. That being said, my Grade 1, which is originally an 8 gauge, is marked NH.

[Dave Suponski]

Bill, I think 8 gauge guns were marked EH and NH respectively.

[greg conomos]

I'm fairly sure my 8 is a GH according to the PGCA letter.

[Dave Suponski]

Somewhere around 1905/07 the EH/NH designation was dropped and these guns were simply G grade and P grade guns.

[Chuck Bishop]

Greg, I'm not interested in what your letter says, I want to know what the letter is on the water table and only if it was made in the 1889 to about 1910 range.

Dave, that's why I only want hammerless 8 gauge gun prior to the EH/NH being dropped. I couldn't find the exact date the EH was dropped in my price lists.

The reason I ask is because I just did a letter for a member on a Grade 2 gun which was an 8 gauge. The price was $85 for the EH plus $35 for the 8 guage upgrade for a total of $120 which is what the Order Book price was. On his watertable is GH, not EH. Was this a common practice or were some guns marked GH and some marked NH?

[Dave Noreen]

My 1889 vintage Quality 2, heavy 12-gauge hammerless, serial number 56213, is marked 2 above the serial number on the watertable and E below it --

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v316/Ansleyone/Parker/Big20045x7.jpg

[greg conomos]

'2' with no letter on the water table
161XXX

[Mills Morrison]

The Parker Story says EH/NH was only used for 10 gauges, but I have seen posts on this forum indicating it was also used on 8 gauges.

[Bill Murphy]

Mills is right, but the catalog tells the story correctly. If an early eight gauge is marked E or N, it is in error. Such errors are not so rare. #160,785, eight gauge, post 1910, marked 2 and GH. I have not seen a catalog entry that describes an eight gauge as an NH or an EH.

[Dave Suponski]

Interesting...I checked the 1895 salesman's catalog last night and the hammergun designate's 10 gauge and 8 gauge guns as EH and NH. They only list hammerless guns in 10 gauge as EH and NH. Investigation continues..

[Mills Morrison]

I wonder why the special designation for 10 gauges, but not for 8 gauges? As Dave says, investigation continues . . . .

[Bill Murphy]

Good work, Dave.

[Daryl Middlebrook]

I have two 8ga. guns that fall into the catagory that Chuck is requesting information on. Both are 6 frame.

One is S/N 102592. Stamped on the water table is 2 over the serial number and G under the serial number. This gun is not listed in TPS page 1003 8ga. production records but is listed in the serialization book. This gun is accompanied by a PGCA research letter dated May 6,2006 stating that it was completed July 1, 1901. According to stock book #36 it was a GH hammerless 8 ga.

The other gun is S/N 107229. Stamped on the water table is 2 over the serial number and G under the serial number.The engraving is standard G engraving with two birds on both sides and the bottom of the receiver. This is a 1901 gun according to page 1000 of TPS. It has 40" damascus barrels.-----BUT, this gun is listed on page 1003 of TPS, and in the serialization book as being a D grade 40" gun. At this writing I do not have a research letter. I can't explain why it is listed as a D grade.---Daryl Middlebrook

[Chuck Bishop]

Attached is a scan of the 1897 price list. Note that the GH is only available in 12 through 20 gauge. The EH is available in 10 gauge at $85, an increase of $5 over the GH. If you read the bottom of the price list, you'll see that an 8 gauge could be made on the EH receiver for an additonal charge of $35. Same with the PH/NH guns but at a lower price. The total price for an 8 gauge Grade 2 (EH) would be $120 which is what the order book specifies for the letter I just wrote for a PGCA member. The problem is he says the watertable clearly has either a G or GH on it. This gun had 40" barrels so the frame size must have been big and the weight 13lbs or over.

I just want to be accurate when I do these letters. If I say it's a EH and the guy's gun is marked GH, he's going to be confused as to why.

Dave N: I looked up your gun in the Order book and reviewed the research letter you have. The only thing I can think of is that your GH 12ga was a heavy gun @ 9 1/2 pounds. They may have had to use the EH frame instead of the GH to accommodate the weight. What is your frame size?

[Mills Morrison]

This price list says Eight bores made to special order and to correspond to any of the grades at $35 above the price for ten bores. This indicates that 8 gauges could be E, G, N or P or any of the letter grades and that they were special order only. This is only an observation and I am no expert by a long shot.

My project 8 gauge was ordered by E. T. Allen who was a semi famous knife maker and who ran a sporting goods (or hardware) shop in San Francisco. I would love to find out if he ordered it for himself or for a customer, but this may really remain a mystery.