Damascus Beauties

[Bruce Day]

In order of appearance:

1. Lefever

2. Mod 97 Winchester


3. Pre 1885 Bernards on a Parker. ( The rib matting machine began use in 1885.)


4. Parker damascus barrels with one piece ( reinforced ) forend lug. ( this is the form of forend lug necessary for beavertail forends)


5. Parker damascus barrels


6. Parker Laminated barrels


7. More Parker laminated


8. Two Parker sets marked laminated. Drew says one of these is incorrectly marked as Laminated.

[Rick Losey]

very nice selection

[Drew Hause]

Close up of the 'Toncin' barrels, courtesy of the 'Gold Towel Collector' :)

http://pic20.picturetrail.com:80/VOL1373/6511424/19406549/403868672.jpg

Parker Laminated Steel refinished by Brad Bachelder

http://pic20.picturetrail.com:80/VOL1373/6511424/19406549/389244643.jpg

http://www.picturetrail.com/sfx/album/view/19406549

Of course ALL pattern welded barrels are 'laminated' ie. layered

[Dean Romig]

Drew, will you ask the "Gold Towel Collector" if that top one is the 10lb. Grade 3?

[Drew Hause]

The 'Gold Towel' claims the top is Grade 5 and bottom Grade 4 :rolleyes:

http://pic20.picturetrail.com:80/VOL1373/6511424/19406549/403868671.jpg

[Dean Romig]

My mistake Drew - I had intended to hit the 4 key instead of the 3 key. I'm sure it is the ten pounder.

[David Noble]

That brings a whole new level of respect to Laminated!

[Kevin McCormack]

Drew, what is (are) 'Toncin' barrels and who is the 'Gold Towel Collector'?

[Bruce Day]

Chain damascus.

[Drew Hause]

'Toncin' is a very high grade non-crolle 'Herringbone' variant, usually found on (later) Lindner Daly's, but a D.B. Wesson is shown here
http://www.picturetrail.com/sfx/album/view/23997270

[Dean Romig]

The "Gold Towel Collector" is the guy who usually photographs his guns on a gold or dark yellow terrycloth towel. It is one of his many 'trademarks'. Incidentally, the nearly neutral shade of the towel offsets the guns very nicely along with allowing us to identify the collector.

Now don't any of you other collectors try to confuse us by using a gold towel backdrop in your photos. :nono:

[Kevin McCormack]

Intriguing and beautiful! And what of the "Gold Towel",,,,,,,,,,,?

[Eldon Goddard]

Were damascus barrels common on Model 97's? I have seen many 97's but never damascus.

[George M. Purtill]

Were damascus barrels common on Model 97's? I have seen many 97's but never damascus.

Excellent question. I had a friendly dispute with a friend who covets 97's about this posting and he swears that they dont exist. So i just sent a link to this thread.

[George M. Purtill]

The "Gold Towel Collector" is the guy who usually photographs his guns on a gold or dark yellow terrycloth towel. It is one of his many 'trademarks'. Incidentally, the nearly neutral shade of the towel offsets the guns very nicely along with allowing us to identify the collector.

Now don't any of you other collectors try to confuse us by using a gold towel backdrop in your photos. :nono:

Dean-o
I will apologize in advance because I think the gold background shows off the guns perfectly.
Im gonna go buy a gold carpet remnant Dean. You know what a difficult time this writer has with his photos!!!

[Bruce Day]

There are a couple questions or comments about Winchester Mod 97's with damascus barrels.

Although I put those photos under a general damascus heading, I think the Mod 97 barrel is more properly a laminated steel barrel rather than damascus.

I do not have Mod '97 production records, so I cannot comment about the rarity of '97 composite barrels, but in my experience, they are seldom seen. There was one for sale at the fall 2011 Louisville KY show. Generally poor condition, beat up stock, no bluing, no barrel colors left, rattlely and the table top dealer wanted $850 for it. I looked at it twice and he tried to convince me that it was a "good deal".

If a person wanted to find one, the spring Wannamacher Tulsa show is probably the next best opportunity.

[todd allen]

I have a Damascus M-97. It's in pretty decent shape, mechanically, all original, un-touched. I would love to have it restored, but have no clue what the value is, or the effect a restoration would have on its value.
I also have a very high condition original M-93 riot gun (I know they didn't call em that back then) with a letter from Cody. The letter confirmed 5 were ordered, but I have no idea how many 20" guns in total were manufactured, and also, many, if not most were bought back by Winchester and destroyed.
I am a huge fan of the M-97’s, btw.

[Rick Losey]

I also have a very high condition original M-93 riot gun (I know they didn't call em that back then) with a letter from Cody. .

don't know about the 93's

the 97's were called trench guns I believe

[todd allen]

This one was manufactured in 1893, evidently for a bank, or prison. Not carried much, with one minor ding in the stock. I have shot it, with 2 1/2" low pressure RST ammo.
I suspect this gun is quite rare.

[Mark Landskov]

The Model 1898 Marlin repeater was available with Damascus in their Grade D version. This is in my 1905 catalog. I do not know how long the option was available. My 1911 WRA Co. catalog shows the 1897 available with 3 blade Damascus for $15.00 extra, and 4 blade for $20.00 extra. These were last shown in the January 1913 catalog.

[todd allen]

I read somewhere that the M-97 Damascus bbl option was $20.00. That could explain the rarity, as that was a lot of money on a 15 dollar gun.

[Steve McCarty]

What a wonderful set of photos!

It is my undertanding that all American shotgun twist and damascus barrels were made abroad, either in England or Belgium, usually Belgium.

Are all of the barrels shown therefore, foreign made, or did we start making some on our side of the pond?

[Drew Hause]

Here you go Steve
https://docs.google.com/document/edit?id=12y9006Ur7mMCqdeeye89c7L4DQrc2iXR8p4S6OIN1 bA

[Steve McCarty]

Here you go Steve
https://docs.google.com/document/edit?id=12y9006Ur7mMCqdeeye89c7L4DQrc2iXR8p4S6OIN1 bA

Drew: Thanks for the info. I'm about half way through it. My wife just came in and told me to "take the garbage out, the big cans." So I have to quit reading for a while and it is nearly cocktail hour.

So far, however; I find evidence that like me, others have stated that Americans did not make damascus/twist barrels. Fact is we did, at least for a while and here and there. Smith and Wesson, Remington and Parker made fine barrels for at least a year and a half. Parker gave it up figuring it was too expensive when they could be imported from Belgium, their labor costs being Lower than ours. Even with the 45% tariff (later lowered to 10% and then free) barrels from Belgium were less expensive and apparently their was no concern over their quality.

I find it interesting that when damascus barrels are mentioned the comments are about the beauty of the design and not their relative strength when compared to other barrels of the era. Apparently it was assumned that twist/dam barrels were plenty strong. The problem was the expense and skill required to build them.

Gotta go, the garbage beckons.

Steve