If you kiss enough frogs....

[Brent Francis]

I like buying old rusty doubles to refinish and "fix up" I always look for something cheap and bad enough I wont feel bad if I screw it up. I recently found this wc scott that looked like it fit the profile of one of my projects. The first series of pictures is the internet ad for the gun. (I talked the guy down a little). The gun came a couple of days ago and i opened it up and the first surprise is that while it was advertise as a 12 it was actually a 16 (okay with me) I got out the Hoppes 9 and started rubbing on it an the the more crud that came off the more excited I got. Really nice engraveing alot of case color, barrels are quite good with very little if any pitting, wood is great. The forend a little banged up but all in all its a pretty nice gun. (See the attached after pics) has a grouse on one side and really nice spaniel on the other (my phots dont do it justice the engraveing is top notch.) Anyone know about these old english Scotts?

[Brent Francis]

Heres a photo from the top. You can really see how much crud was on it when compared to the before pics. It really needs to be taken apart and cleaned right. Normally Id do it but the screws are so heavily engraved Im going to let a pro do it.

[Mills Morrison]

Nice find. I bought a Scott off Gunbroker which turned out to be in worse condition than the pictures, so had to send it back. I still want to get one eventually.

[Brent Francis]

I never knew much English guns. I have always pretty much collected american doubles. Im kind of blown away by the fit and finish of this old English gun. I guess that WC scott and sons were a low price alternative to the London made guns like Holland and Holland and Purdeys. Ive never really held one of those but its hard to believe they were that much better than this one.

[Eldon Goddard]

I like buying the rusty stuff as well. I am looking at am L.C. Smith 0 grade it has some minor stock problems and just needs cleaned for $250. I got my ithaca flues for $150 a little pitting,off face, and the stock was cut but when I get it running it will be a nice gun for the money. It is amazing what is still out there for good prices. That W.C. Scott is a beautiful gun.

[Brent Francis]

Yes, Im glad I havent been bitten by the need for a perfect "untouched" unique configuration antique shotgun. Way too many of them are priced by the sellers looking for Great Gatsby to bail them out and they seem to sit on GB and GI for years waiting. I was looking at the "original" 24 inch CHE 20ga for 49,500. "One of a kind", and I think so what. Id like a 20ga CHE but actually 26 inch barrels look better to me and probaly perform better and now that you mention it a DHE 20 looks pretty similar and certainly a restored DHE 20 with 26 inch barrels could be had for alot less than 49,500. Im not saying that Im immune to the collector disease but it does display some pretty strange symptoms in certain people. My theory is that obsesive collector disorder "OCD" is caused by a mutated form of Mad Cow Virus.

[Destry L. Hoffard]

I've got a dandy pair of Scott guns, both marked Bogardus Club Gun. A 30 inch 10 gauge and a 30 inch 16 gauge. One of these days I'll sneak up on a 12 gauge to match, the 20 gauge will be a bit harder I'm guessing. They did make one, I've seen pictures!


DLH

[John Campbell]

Brent:
The old Scott you found has great potential. If the work is done right. My advice is to NOT do any part of the work unless you are totally confident in your skills.
An English gun is thoroughbred in a world of draft horses. And the Scott you have is finely made and worth the utmost care in revival.
s
Sorry if I may seem negative... but I've seen too many of these great English guns bodgered by well-intentioned, but inept hobbyists.
If you have any questions about working on it, please don't hesitate to ask me.

Best, Kensal

[Mills Morrison]

Destry, That is cool. I will be happy if if get a good W C Scott, regardless of its history.

Kensal, It looks like he has done a good job so far. The old adage "stop while you're ahead" may apply

[Brent Francis]

Thanks for the advice. Yes early in the process I realized this wasnt my usual basket case ithaca field and I backed away and I am simply admireing it. Barrels look uncut and are a little over 28inches . I dont have a 16guage choke guage so I dont know what it is choked. It has a beautiful checkered buttplate that I suspect is horn. My picture really washs out the reciever color. The metal is quite dark and in the right light is iridescent indigo. The only downside is the length of pull is only 13 1/4. I guess it must have belonged to a short guy with a bowler hat. Now im scanning ebay for a bargain oak and leather case so that it can return to its life as a proper english gent.

[Brent Francis]

Destry found this article online with some pictures of a Bogardus 16ga scott. Nice looking guns. http://www.16ga.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=55832[/URL]p=55832[/COLOR]

[John Campbell]

Brent:
Don't fret over the odd barrel length. Most Brit guns were "give or take a 1/2".

And... just use the Scott in cold weather. Your coat will add 1" or so to the LOP.

Best, Kensal

[Brent Francis]

Thanks Kensal, I think I had read that about English guns barrel lengths. Its pretty clear that they havent been cut since the keels are in place and nicely done and the tubes are touching. I can also see that one barrel is choked tighter than the other. I have no doupt the chambers are shorter than 2 3/4 "and was wondering if there were 2 inch 16s ( like some 12s) or whether 2 1/2" were the standard. From what Ive found, the gun was made in 1881. Unfortunately in Houston I can only wear my barbour coat a few days every year.

[John Campbell]

Brent:
For cartridges, you can always get 2 1/2" from RST. Or... load your own light stuff. I use 2 3/4" AA hulls and 3/4 or 7/8 oz. light loads in all my 2 1/2" guns. Never a problem -- and you don't have to fiddle with shortening hulls. Sherman Bell proved pressures are only about 25 psi higher with skivved mouth 2 3/4" hulls. No problem breaking targets either.

Best, Kensal

[Steve McCarty]

Congratulations, Brent and good eye! We all enjoy bring back a rough gun and make her speak again. Good for you!

How much work are you going to do on the bore?

[Brent Francis]

Steve, Thanks, I ran a brass cleaning brush and some Hoppes #9 and a few cotton patches through it and the bores look really good. Some very light shallow pits just ahead of the chamber and two very small shallow dents in the left barrel that can be seen on the inside. I actually prefer to see a little roughness in the bores of an old gun because it means that its less likely anybody has honed the walls too thin. My plan is to leave the bores alone.

[Steve McCarty]

Steve, Thanks, I ran a brass cleaning brush and some Hoppes #9 and a few cotton patches through it and the bores look really good. Some very light shallow pits just ahead of the chamber and two very small shallow dents in the left barrel that can be seen on the inside. I actually prefer to see a little roughness in the bores of an old gun because it means that its less likely anybody has honed the walls too thin. My plan is to leave the bores alone.

I would leave them as it too.

I have always wondered how a rough or semi-rough bore effects patterns. Intuitively, to me, it seems that rough or slighly pitted bores would not make much diff. Do the pellets bounce off rough spots, distorting the patter, or just blow right by them?

I have shot rifles with rough bores and some worked fine. One, a badly ringed, dark bore in an old GEW98 made in 1915 darn near shoots MOA! Funny.

[Brent Francis]

Steve, I think that with modern plastic sleaved wads the interaction of the bore with the shot is alot less. I had read that as regards rifles that it is just the last bit of the rifleing at the muzzle that makes most of the difference on accuracy

[Steve McCarty]

Steve, I think that with modern plastic sleaved wads the interaction of the bore with the shot is alot less. I had read that as regards rifles that it is just the last bit of the rifleing at the muzzle that makes most of the difference on accuracy

Thanks Brent for the info on rough bores. I had not heard that, but it sounds right.