Beat up AH Grade 6

[Johnny Thompson]

Hello all, new guy here. I just bought a Parker AH - Grade 6 in absolutely deplorable condition. Serial # 78xxx, made in 1894. 12 gauge, frame size 2.It's Damascus, 30" full/full and was apparently a waterfowl gun. Heavily used and not cared for, there is no original finish left on the metal, barrels pitted, slightly Off Face (you can close the barrels on a post-it-note, but it won't pull out) and the engraving is worn thin. The gold grip cap is still attached and has the skeletonized butt plate. A local guy examined it and advised it was all there and all original. Question is, is it worth getting refurbished? I'm not a shotgun guy and not really interested in doing that, but as the gun was, at one time, exceptional I wondered if a true collector would feel that refurbishing would be an option, or just sell it for parts, etc.
Any advice will be appreciated.

[Mark Ouellette]

HI Johnny,

Please do not "part out" an AH Parker. Chances are that if you have no interest in keeping the gun someone will buy it from you with a potential profit!

Is it worth restroring an AH? If that is a question concerning potential return on investment factors to consider are:
1. What you paid for the gun?
2. How much minimum barrel wall thickness will remain if the barrels are honed smooth? A #2 frame Parker 12 gauge probably has pretty thick barrels. If the MBWT will less that will be safe for proper loads then you might want to stop here.
3. What price a VERY similar gun which has been restored will bring?
4. The cost of a perfect restoration?

Now, if you have any competent gunsmith restore it you may be pouring your money down a hole. There are few persons that have the abilities to properly restore a Parker AH to an "as new" condition. There are things as simple as achieving proper colors for the period from case hardening that can make or break a restoration. The shape of the stock and checkering are also big factors in this. Finally, you wrote that the engraving is worn thin. Some gunsmiths can acid etch engraving and bring it back to life. If the engraving needs to be chased or recut the cost of restoration will rise.

So, take your time. Show the gun to knowledgeable Parker collectors but do not accept any offers from them without getting assessments/opinions from others. Take your gun to a competent gunsmith with a reputation for Parker restorations. He (or perhaps she?) will tell you what the AH will cost to restore properly. Toward this paragraph, where are you located?

If you desire a more accurate online assessment you will need to post high quality photos.

PS: I have an AH in restoration presently and another that may get restocked. These guns are worth saving!

For what it is worth,
Mark

[Bill Murphy]

Yup, pictures. And where are you located so we can get you some help.

[Brian Dudley]

John,

Thank you for your post. It is always nice to hear about High grade Parkers. At the time of manufacture, the AH grade would have been the second best offered by Parker.
It is always interesting to hear about or see very high grade guns that are in very bad shape because usually they were well cared for by the owners that paid so much for them.

You should really post pictures of your AH grade if you can. We would all love to see them. Maybe the gun is not in as bad of shape as you make it out to be.

Just a note about what you have shared...
If you can close a paper in the breech and it will not pull out or support the weight of the gun, then that is actually pretty good.

[Johnny Thompson]

Hi y'all, and thanks for the information. I'm in West Texas and there are some good gunsmiths around here, unfortunately none that I'm aware of who can tackle a restoration. I took about 30 photos, but have no idea how to post them on this forum. I'll try my usual method and see if I can get some out there.

Johnny T.

Nope, can't figure it out. If you e-mail me at jht3944@suddenlink.net I can forward them.

[Mills Morrison]

I am relatively new here as well, but I would think an AH Parker would have to be really bad off before not being worth restoring. If not to you, then probably to someone else.

[Rick Losey]

Hi y'all, and thanks for the information. I'm in West Texas and there are some good gunsmiths around here, unfortunately none that I'm aware of who can tackle a restoration. I took about 30 photos, but have no idea how to post them on this forum. I'll try my usual method and see if I can get some out there.

Johnny T.

Nope, can't figure it out. If you e-mail me at jht3944@suddenlink.net I can forward them.

have you stored your photo on a web hosting site such as photbucket??

[Johnny Thompson]

No, I don't know how to do that. The photos are in my computer file, Fine Pix Viewer. I can send them e-mail, but I don't know how to get them onto this site.

[Mike Shepherd]

Hi Johnny:

I emailed you. I am in Amarillo.

Thanks,

Mike

[Brian Dudley]

John,

Posting photos right here on the site is very easy. it is much like attaching photos to your E-mail. You have to use the New Reply feature. Not the quick reply. Then click the attachment tab to start uploading your photos. When they are all uploaded, close that window out and then click attach all back at the attach icon. I am sure there is a thread on attaching photos on here somewhere too.

[Johnny Thompson]

Thanks to everyone for the photo tips. I'll try them next time. Meanwhile, I e-mailed them the AmarilloMike and he's gonna post them for me on this thread. Thanks B. Dudley and Mike.

Johnny T.

[Mike Shepherd]

I don't think this worked. I got messages the bmp files are too large.

Edit: Nope. They are already pretty small. I am surprised they exceeded the limit.

[Dave Suponski]

Mike, You can email them to me at ctdoubles@aol.com and I'll see what I can do if you run into a wall.

[Mike Shepherd]

Dave just sent them to you. I am stuck and thanks.

Best,

Mike

[Dave Suponski]

Johnny's AH

[Dave Suponski]

More...

[Dave Suponski]

Some More...

[Dave Suponski]

Last Ones...

[Bill Murphy]

What a great original A Grade, about the best I've seen. I think we should pitch in an buy this gentleman a PGCA letter. I will pitch in ten bucks. What about the rest of you? Look at those screws! Johnny, you are the man.

[Mills Morrison]

I vote he sends it to one of the pros for a fix up job.

[Dave Suponski]

Boy! It will take a few bucks but what a gun to bring back...

[Mills Morrison]

Imagine the before and after photos . . .

[Johnny Thompson]

I can't figure out how to post the photos, but not to worry, I'll get my grandson over tomorrow evening and get him to do it for me so you can see them. Yes, I have lots of "before" photos, but looks like "After" will be way beyond my means.

Johnny

[Ray Masciarella]

What do you fellas think the value would if it were a perfect factory restoration?

That would help in determining if it is worth doing. I have an AH that has no finish and some wear. Always thought about a restoration but it costs a lot. At least 10k. Not worth it I think if you want to be able to get your money out of it. But if money were no object, what a great project and what a gun you'd have!

It's hard to tell how bad this gun is because the photos aren't great but I guess it doesn't matter if it is restorable. It will end up new anyway. It would be great to see it restored and I don't think you can really do any harm to it by restoring it.

Just my two cents.

Ray

[Eric Estes]

I imagine Johnny has recieved a number of PMs by now... :corn:

[Brian Dudley]

Well that one is very well worn! But it looks like very honest wear. And the screws are not even too messed with. That one was hunted with!

[charlie cleveland]

great old gun it favors most of my old shooters....charlie

[Mills Morrison]

At least it is not mint condition and therefore too nice to shoot!!!

[Bill Murphy]

As Eric implies, some PMs have probably been exchanged about this gun, in other words, offers to buy. I would love to buy that gun myself, but will wait for it to be offered for sale. However, unlike others posting here, I would leave this great gun as is, except for bore and mechanical repairs. Imagine what it took to make this gun look like it does. Maybe I'll get a PM from the owner, who knows?

[Steve Huffman]

So much for our rules !:rolleyes:

[greg conomos]

I wouldn't restore it either....the finished product would be less than 51% Parker.

It would be a fun gun to use as a shooter - you can bet no oneelse would show up with one like it.

What's with the right barrel where it joins the breech? Why is that line so wavy?

[Brian Dudley]

I too was wondering that. Almost makes it look like it has side clips.

[Johnny Thompson]

Hello everyone, Thanks for all the tips and information. I figured out that my photo file was too big to post. I'm sure that there is a sure-fire way to post them, but it's beyond me.

I did figure out, and tried it successfully, that I can e-mail one high quality photo at a time. They can be enlarged, and they show great detail

If anyone wants to see a few, just email me at jht3944@suddenlink.net. Let me know what portion of the gun you wish to see, or several areas, and I'll send them to you one at a time.

Thanks again, Johnny T.

[Johnny Thompson]

I think that the old gal received a bad knock there. Eveything fits fine, so I'm not sure.

[Ray Masciarella]

Is that a name engraved on the grip cap?

[Bob Jurewicz]

Well I am now the proud owner of this gun!!
This morning I went to a gun show in Snyder, TX and the first set of tables I viewed had this 12 G AH for sale. Careful examination did show it to be in very bad, but yet, potentiially shootable condition. The current owner had all the PGCA thread and Letter. The gun is true to the Parker Letter Chuck Bishop provided in April: 30' barrels, RH Mod/LH Close (????), engraved grip cap (" S A Pace" ), 15" LOP to SBP, 3 1/2" DAH. The gun is on a 2 Frame with unstruck barrel weight of 4#15oz. Bores are rough, but I don't think I will hesitate to shoot with Maxi Lite RSTs once I tighten it up.
Ironically this is one of the few times I've traveled without my workshop of gauges and tools nor cash. We worked a price and payment method and after about 4 hours of of indecision on my part the gun is with me at my ranch in Colorado City.
I am considering a complete quality restoration true to factory original. Lots of time for that decision and saving the vast wealth needed to accomplish.
Bob Jurewicz

[Brian Dudley]

Bob, I hope to see it next weekend if you will be at the Rochester show.

[Russ Jackson]

Hello Bob ,Any chance of posting some pictures so we can take a look at the old girl ! By the way ,Congrats. on finding it and Best of Luck having it restored !

[Bob Jurewicz]

Russ,
Pics are included earlier in this thread. Please let me know what you think!!
Bob Jurewicz

[Russ Jackson]

Bob ,For some reason my first pass through this post ,the pics. either weren't there or some how I missed them ,either way ..... Now for , " What do I Think " ,well ,I think You are indeed a Fortunate Man , Good Find !! Now have you decided just what to do with her yet or are you planning to show up at a little Gun show in Pa. and try to pedal her off ???:rotf:

[Bob Jurewicz]

Russ,
No idea yet! Just excited with owning an AH at this point.
Bob Jurewicz

[Russ Jackson]

I have to agree Bob ,That really is a rare find these days and especially at a Gun Show ,you just never know what you are going to run into when you start the day !

[Jeff Bonadurer]

Bob,
Congrats on your new gun. She's a beautiful old Parker. Keep her original.
Just my two cents. Enjoy it. It would be interesting to hear of its history
or what you know about the gun. Did you send for a letter ?

Kind regards,

Jeff

[Bob Jurewicz]

Jeff,
I got all info with gun.
Ordered on 12-1-1984 by Hibbard, Spencer and Bartlett for SA Pace of Corsicanna Tx, shipped 3-18-1895. On 11-11 1907 sent for new forend an clean, 9-19-1908 dents, clean and rebrown. Also have all the info on Captain SA Pace and his grocery company in Coricana, TX.
Bob Jurewicz

[Bob Jurewicz]

Just looked in the gun closet and found a couple boxes of RSTs. 2 layers of scotch tape on the hook and gun is tight. Doves on Monday!!
Bob Jurewicz

[Russ Jackson]

Just looked in the gun closet and found a couple boxes of RSTs. 2 layers of scotch tape on the hook and gun is tight. Doves on Monday!!
Bob Jurewicz

NICE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Bill Murphy]

Congratulations, Bob. You need to tell this story. I wonder if the original poster sold it to a PM guy. If he had PMed me, I may be telling your story.

[Mills Morrison]

Keep us posted. Very cool gun.

[Bob Jurewicz]

The original poster has shared some very interesting history of the gun. It was used by three (3) generations of a Texas family mainly as a waterfowler. It was acquired from the original owner's grandson. I have all family details.
Bob Jurewicz

[Mills Morrison]

That would make a great Parker Pages story.

[Bob Jurewicz]

First blood.

http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j106/Bobguns/securedownload1_zpsbf7d1368.jpg (http://s78.photobucket.com/user/Bobguns/media/securedownload1_zpsbf7d1368.jpg.html)

[todd allen]

First blood, for you. If that gun could talk, . . .

[Mills Morrison]

Wow. It goes to show you guns can be in better condition than they appear in photos sometimes.

[Ray Masciarella]

Bob, can you post close-ups of the ebgraving? it must be really nice.

[Bob Jurewicz]

Ray,
The engraving is almost worn smooth on the receiver. The pictures on page 2 of this thread are about as good as it gets.
Bob Jurewicz

[Ray Masciarella]

Bob

Wow, good to see that a Parker could take that much use and still be in service. A testimate to Parker's fine guns.

Ray

[Steve Parker]

I'm sure many of you have wondered what became of the "beat up AH". Well, open your Spring DGJ to page 27 for a great story and pictures. Many thanks to John Campbell, Brad Bachelder, Bob Jurewicz, Kirk Merrington, Bob Strosin, and Edgar Spencer. Much appreciated.

[John Campbell]

I hope Dr. Parker will not mind if I post a few photos of this historic AH Parker after it was so artfully restored by those craftsmen he mentions. BTW... For you historians, the Texas Spindle Top discovery came well after Corsicana.

[Bob Jurewicz]

DGJ just arrived. Can't wait to read the Article.
What a beauty it turned out to be. I am so happy it went to the right new home!
Bob Jurewicz

[Richard Flanders]

Wow. What a beauty. Bravo to the craftsmen involved in the project.

[Tom Jay]

The case is obviously not original. Where did it come from?

[bob weeman]

Anyone here pick up the beat up AH 10 gauge at Poulin's? A bit rough but with seeing what the craftsman did with this AH it could be a beauty too.....

[Steve Parker]

The case was custom made for the gun by PGCA member Edgar Spencer. He has made some fabulous cases for other members also. A pleasure to work with. Excellent craftsmanship.

[Harryreed]

We have some very talented craftsmen on this site. Nice job on both Parker and case.

[Rich Anderson]

There's a nice article in the current issue of DGJ on a restored A grade. Brad did the work and Bob Strosin the engraving.

[edgarspencer]

There's a nice article in the current issue of DGJ on a restored A grade. Brad did the work and Bob Strosin the engraving.

That's the same gun this thread is talking about, Rich.

[Rich Anderson]

That came out beautifully. Well worth the time and expense in my opinion.

[Dave Suponski]

So.... Who is having a senior moment now Rich?

[Rich Anderson]

Oh come on now that post started years ago. It did turn out quite nicely. What was that moment again???:)

[Garry L Gordon]

Gentlemen, Try coming into this for the first time today! Talk about confusing. Thank goodness I've read the DGJ article. The work on this gun appears to be superb. I've had Brad Bachelder work on many guns in my safe. He does incredible work.