Too Bad

[Dean Romig]

Here's a very interesting Parker. The seller calls it a "field gun" but I'd be witting to bet it was originally a competition trap or live bird gun. It sports a Miller trigger, a Monte Carlo stock, a modified safety (either pinned or has some mechanism in the tang that affects the safety) but it's too bad the barrels have been poorly "mono-blocked" and the checkering is wrong for a Grade 3. Anyway, it has some interesting features.

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=253810839

[Paul Ehlers]

Boy that old girl has had some serious gunsmithing done to her. I wish it was listed in the serialization book. It looks as if the checking is either covering up a wrist repair or a butt graft. The trigger guard tang has been welded up to make a straight grip tang and isn't wearing a serial # like a factory Parker would.

Too bad about the cobbled up sleeving job as well. My opinion for what's it worth is it's a parts gun, look's like a good action and forearm and not much more.

I just wish the old girl could talk so she could tell us about the things she's done and lived to tell about it.

[Steve Huffman]

Who is he trying to fool with that description ? :eek:

[Francis Morin]

Who is he trying to fool with that description ? :eek: Like so many "numbnuts" on gunbusters or G.I. gastro-int. sites- these guys don't know crap from Crisco- this parkers was probably a grade 3 DH with Damascus barrels, at one time Frank LeFever and sons did a barrel job on older Damascus barreled doubles- and speaking of Frank (German root origin- tip of a spear) Auggie or Frank Pachmayr (not the way this clown miss-spelled it, Gott in Himmel) would say "Alles ist verruckt" if they read this description of the POS clear spacer to a Pachmayr pad as being done by that great Germanic gunsmithing firm migrated to CA- and anyone can install a single trigger, doing it right- a whole 'nother ball game- Cabela's has an older DH 12 with a modified Trojan set of No 2 frame barrels with short top rib anda Trojan forearm at $2500, shifting gears to my favorite sidelocks- another clown has a Crown Grade 12 Smith described as being built in 1902- a Monogram- yes- a Crown- no-- unless he hit a typo and meant 1920--

So many clowns trying out for the band leaders job as they sense some $ in those old vintage classics we love- but they come ill-prepared and never learned the basic "7 P's" of preparation- shame!!:p:banghead::crying::crying::crying:

[Brian Dudley]

Hard to tell what all is going on there. But a straight grip conversion for sure and the checkering on the wrist is completely odd to say the least. I could surely use a few parts off that gun for myself. but not at that price.

[Bill Murphy]

Not everyone is an expert on double guns. This fellow gives us the opportunity to look at a legible picture at least.

[Francis Morin]

Hard to tell what all is going on there. But a straight grip conversion for sure and the checkering on the wrist is completely odd to say the least. I could surely use a few parts off that gun for myself. but not at that price. I could see maybe just under 4 figures for this as a Project Parker- BUT I want to test fire it and check out the single trigger first. I think this dude has a case of "newbieparkerprice-itis" he heard that Parkers, like pianos, have intrincsic value- maybe- like the A1-S Jack Puglisi bought from Julia's- or a Steinway played at Carnegie Hall by Van Cligburn- but not a "bawdyhouse Grinnell brothers spinet from Canal Street" or a reworked and re-done grade 3 12 gauge Parker-as common as 16d nails on a building site--IMO

[ed good]

poorly mono blocked? looks cosmetic only...the price seems fair for what it is?

[charlie cleveland]

i a gree the price is not to bad..would still be a good shooter in my opinion...i would not be ashamed to tote it around.... charlie

[Eric Eis]

I agree with Brian, nice parts gun. And yes I think the seller doesn't even know how bad the condition is.... Would not be a bad shooter if the price was lower.

[Chris Travinski]

Not to discount the seller any, but this is why you ALWAYS need to get pictures before you buy a gun! At least he's a good photographer.

[Brian Dudley]

Yes. It was good to see many pictures in the auction. It accureately shows the condition and issues with the gun. And by all means, if all works and it shoots well then it is not a bad gun, maybe just overpriced.
I will refer to my Aftermarket barreled P grade 12g. that I shoot. Not a collector by any means, but a great little gun. But I did not Pay a whole lot for it either.

[Dean Romig]

if all works and it shoots well then it is not a bad gun, maybe just overpriced.

I can't agree with you Brian re- this particular gun. That statement may be valid with other guns that are what they should be but not this one, in my sometimes narrow-minded opinion.

[Michael Murphy]

Excuse my ignorance, but does the use of the term "mono-blocked" mean sleeved, or something else?

[Dean Romig]

Sleeving and mono-blocking are similar in appearance. Sleeving is where the breech end of the barrels are cut just forward of the chambers and new tubes precisely fitted into the breech section. Mono-block is a term used in the production of a new SXS or O/U where the breech section of the barrels, including the locking lug and top rib section are machined from a single casting and the barrels fitted as described above... so, 'mono-block' is not really the correct term for what has been done to this gun.

[Francis Morin]

In Mike McIntosh's fine book 1989 ed. best guns- when he discussed Beretta he describes the mono-blocking process, which Beretta and other high end European makers have been using for years- and as Beretta goes back to the 17th century as a premiere gun maker in Italy, not too bad a record--

The only experience I have ever had with a "sleeved" if that is the right term here- barrel set was about 20 years- when Damascus barrels were "unsafe" for modern loads- a friend inherited a fine 12 BH Parker with 30" Bernard barrels, No. 2 frame- made in 1911- a real fine piece of craftsmanship from Parker's "Golden Age", at least IMO here.

He contacted Frank LeFever and Sons in Lee center NY (if memory serves) and they stripped and re-used the ribs, but mono-blocked Nitro proof barrels into the Damascus breech 'stubs" about 3- 3.5" from the breech and top rib doll's head forward- soldered and re-set the original ribs, proof tested it and returned it via insured UPS to him. I don't recall what the cost was, he still has it and shoots it and was pleased with the work done.

I am told that LeFever and Sons is no longer in business-today we might not need do that- if the wall thickness and bore condition passes our gunsmith's inspection, we can use RST low pressure loads in those older guns.

Hope this helps, there are others here who can shed more light on this subject than i can, as I have not yet owned a double with the mono-blocked barrels, only seen and handled them--:bigbye::bigbye:

[Michael Murphy]

Thanks. I knew what mono-blocked barrels are, but didn't know how it applied to this particular shotgun. The "rings" around the barrel resemble those that you see on some mono-blocked barrels. But that sort of decoration is also used sometimes to hide the "seam" created with the sleeving of barrels.
Which leaves me still not knowing if these decorative engraved circles reflect a sleeving operation on the gun or are just decorative.

[Francis Morin]

take the barrels off the gun and check both the top and bottom ribs for a cut line- not to be confused with the 'expansion joint" on the top rib, similar to that on a sidewalk or other poured concrete. My LC Smiths show that joint clearly, on the middle to higher grades they are filled with silver- show up quite clearly.

If this gun has mono-blocked or sleeved barrels from the orginal un sleeved barrels, there should be signs of the ribs re-set, at least in my limited experience.

Murphy is it now? Good Irish name indeed. I've been a firm believe in Mr. Murphy's law for many years, have also been wearing his fine shoes ( in his partnership with Mr. Johnson of course) as well. Not my checkbook on the line here, but are you considering making an offer on this Parker?:bigbye::bigbye:

[Michael Murphy]

Not considering an offer. Just interested in gaining knowledge. I've never seen a Parker with either mono-blocked or sleeved barrels.