What do you make of?

[Frank Srebro]

What do our Parker experts make of the two 3's on the barrel flats of this 12g/32" VHE in the 208,000's serial number range? I don't have this Parker in hand as yet and thus haven't had a chance to measure its chambers.
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[Mike Franzen]

My guess is chamber length. If that’s the case you have a rare gun.

[Dave Noreen]

IMO more likely the chambers were lengthened after market and the gunsmith so doing marked the barrel flats.

The answer will be a letter from the PGCA.

[Frank Srebro]

Interesting that the 3’s in question look like the same font as the factory overscript 3 on the barrel weight stamp ……. ?

[Paul Ehlers]

Interesting that the 3’s in question look like the same font as the factory overscript 3 on the barrel weight stamp ……. ?

I agree, both 3's were made with the same stamp.

[Dave Noreen]

I inherited three sets of letter and number stamps from my father. Guess I could whang a number on a barrel flat (I'd actually be afraid to) or in the wood under a trigger guard.

[Dean Romig]

The 3 oz. stamp is obviously made with a smaller 3 die.
The left and right barrel flat 3’s were made with the same die.





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[Chuck Bishop]

You won't get any help from me, we don't have records for this gun.

[edgarspencer]

Who ever applied the 3 stamps could have gone the extra mile, or inch, and applied a " stamp, if it was intended to signify chamber length.

[Mike Franzen]

You’ll have to measure the chambers when you get the gun.

[Frank Srebro]

I inherited three sets of letter and number stamps from my father. Guess I could whang a number on a barrel flat (I'd actually be afraid to) or in the wood under a trigger guard.

I never proposed or alluded this was a 3-inch chambered Parker but have to say if the factory or someone “whanged” (two) number 3’s onto the barrel flats there had to be a good reason. I did receive this gun today but have misplaced my precision chamber gauge and may have to make up another one on the lathe. Yeah I know gents try to measure using with rolled up postcards, small machinist rulers and other improvised means but I’ll try first to do a better search or wait until I can make another gauge.

Meanwhile thanks all for your inputs.

[Brian Dudley]

The font is actually different and not to mention different size.

[edgarspencer]

Just a thought, but the bottom of the indentation 'appears' to be the same finish as the surrounding area, and the weight stamping.I've never stamped a cold rust blued surface, but I'm wondering if it would appear that the original finish is just forced inward, or would it appear 'brighter' ?

[Dean Romig]

Actually, when a stamp is applied I believe the surrounding metal is forced upward rather than inward… not to be argumentative…

Same theory applies when knurling.




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[edgarspencer]

not to be argumentativ.

I'm sure you meant 'argumentative', but either way, I'd expect no less from you.

[Dean Romig]

I'm sure you meant 'argumentative', but either way, I'd expect no less from you.

I could be rong but I thin that might have been a typo :corn:





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[edgarspencer]

I could be rong but I thin that might have been a typo :corn: Rite or rong, I got your point. You are correct that stamping does force material up and away, but the bottom of the (questionable) 3 was forced straight inward, and my only thought, which I'm barely able to remember, is that, would this be reflected in 'altered' appearance of the original rust blued finish?

[Frank Srebro]

…… You are correct that stamping does force material up and away, but the bottom of the (questionable) 3 was forced straight inward, and my only thought, which I'm barely able to remember, is that, would this be reflected in 'altered' appearance of the original rust blued finish?

I would think so.

OK I hate to disappoint all the gents who thought the 3’s were whacked with a hand metal stamp after leaving Meriden and to indicate chambers that were punched out to 3-inch, but I found my chamber gauge and both chambers measure 2-5/8” as typically done by Parker for 2-3/4” shells.

Any other theories?

[CraigThompson]

I would think so.

OK I hate to disappoint all the gents who thought the 3’s were whacked with a hand metal stamp after leaving Meriden and to indicate chambers that were punched out to 3-inch, but I found my chamber gauge and both chambers measure 2-5/8” as typically done by Parker for 2-3/4” shells. Any other theories?

Geppetto awaking in the middle of the night then staggering to his bench grabbed a metal stamp and whacked the 3 into the under side of the chamber flats not realizing what he was doing . Afterward Superman was called to the scene to get the 3 removed but being like kryptonite he couldn’t do a thing . :bigbye:

[edgarspencer]

Owned by a Upper, liked his first two so much he called this one 3.

[edgarspencer]

OK, seriously now. Perhaps there are two other barrels sets (added ?) Did you get a letter on it?

[Frank Srebro]

Edgar, there's no record on its serial number and hence a letter isn't available.

[edgarspencer]

The chamber length is the only logical thing, except it could have been less cryptic if it was stamped '3" chamber', that and the obvious fact that they aren't lengthened.

[Frank Srebro]

Since the "3" is stamped on both sides my current theory is that this Parker was ordered with 3/4 chokes (Improved Mod). Both chokes have 28-30 points of constriction and both are full tapered and without a parallel run. That's indicative of factory choke work and not some guy with an adjustable reamer who had at 4/4 (Full) chokes.

Surely, many of our enthusiasts have never heard of 1/4, 2/4, 3/4 and 4/4 chokes but that's how they were often referred to a century ago.

[Dean Romig]

Since the "3" is stamped on both sides my current theory is that this Parker was ordered with 3/4 chokes (Improved Mod). Both chokes have 28-30 points of constriction and both are full tapered and without a parallel run. That's indicative of factory choke work and not some guy with an adjustable reamer who had at 4/4 (Full) chokes.

Surely, many of our enthusiasts have never heard of 1/4, 2/4, 3/4 and 4/4 chokes but that's how they were often referred to a century ago.

We've heard of those chokes Frank but Parker never stamped choke constrictions on their barrels until well into the Remington/Ilion era when Remington was producing their own Parker barrels in the Ilion factory in New York. At that point they were stamping the barrels with the actual choke designation, e.g. FULL, MOD, SKEET IN, SKEET OUT, etc.... never 3 for 3/4 choke.





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[Stan Hillis]

Never?

That's a tough call, Dean.

[Frank Srebro]

We've heard of those chokes Frank but Parker never stamped choke constrictions on their barrels until well into the Remington/Ilion era when Remington was producing their own Parker barrels in the Ilion factory in New York. At that point they were stamping the barrels with the actual choke designation, e.g. FULL, MOD, SKEET IN, SKEET OUT, etc.... never 3 for 3/4 choke.

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Just to confirm, I am happy with this new VHE/12g/32"/DT/straight grip acquisition. It's a high condition gun and with nice higher stock dimensions; and I'm not trying to convince anyone it is something it is not.

I posted here asking what 3's stamped on both barrel flats might indicate on this 208000's Parker (1924). And I later confirmed the chambers are factory length at 2-5/8" and were not lengthened to 3-inch. I also proposed a theory that a 3 stamped on each flat might have been done to indicate 3/4 choke (Improved- Mod) which in fact both chokes do measure at 28 and 30 points of constriction.

With all that in mind Dean's reply citing Remington era choke markings doesn't add any value. My question to Parker experts was and is, what might the 3's indicate on a 1924 gun? And I ask that any future replies focus on that question, and not to get replies with a sermonette that doesn't pertain or add value.

[Dean Romig]

My apologies to you Frank and anyone else I’ve offended.

My “never” comment was meant as a standard Parker practice.





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[Reggie Bishop]

[QUOTE=Dean Romig;452913]My apologies to you Frank and anyone else I’ve offended.

My “never” comment was meant as a standard Parker practice.


Apologies? I don't think you said anything offensive. Just stating your opinion. Your input is appreciated I am sure.

[Stan Hoover]

With all that in mind Dean's reply citing Remington era choke markings doesn't add any value

You wanted the Parker experts opinion and he stated that he was not aware that Parker marked choke designations on the barrel flats, how is that not helpful?

Curiosity question, how many American SXS gun manufacturers marked the choke designations on the barrel flats using the 1-4 number system?

[Frank Srebro]

I might be at the point of diminishing returns on my post question.

Last call: If anyone has an answer or can logically think out of the box, on why both barrel flats on my 1924 Parker are stamped with 3's, I would greatly value their reply.

I will not be going back and forth on anything else that’s irrelevant to that question. Thank you.

[allen newell]

A little humor on this site goes a long way.

[james orr]

Great gun Frank regardless of the 3's. They will just remain a mystery. Enjoy it and soot it well.
Regards,
JimO