Recoil pad question

[Ed Hardy]

Good evening, and an early Merry Christmas (season) to everyone. I have recently obtained a nice SC Grade Parker SBT, and am looking forward to shooting it. The recoil pad on it is serviceable, but has seen far better days. It appears to be a Jostam, but without the slots I have seen in these in the past.

According to the Parker Story, Parker didn't offer a specific pad, certainly not one of their own, so really anything goes on these? Connecticut Shotgun seems to offer a Galazan Jostam repro, a Hy-Gun, which might be ok, but they also have a repro Silver and repro Hawkins.

I am new to this field; I have collected and shot military rifles and old handguns for years, and just in the last four years have gotten into trap shooting. I stumbled across a couple of nice old trap shotguns which I love shooting, and have now been more actively hunting down examples. Recoil pads are definitely an area of deterioration on most of them. What do the experienced folks on this site feel would be most appropriate on a Parker SBT, since I wouldn't be able to find the same style repro Jostam as is on it? That would be assuming that the old Jostam IS the original one mounted to the gun.

Any advice appreciated!
Thanks

Ed

[Dave Noreen]

Those sponge rubber pads first hit the market as the Huntley recoil pad --

138438

but by 1916 the had been acquired by JOSTAM and became part of their line. A 1916 JOSTAM folder --

138440

1937 JOSTAM catalog --

138439

[Pat Dugan]

The heart shaped Hawkins and Silvers
Pad from England are most desired.
I have a 1941 gun that when I got it looked
Unfired, has heart shaped Hawkins

I had a DHE 20 ga. with correct silvers pad on it, was questionable
shot 2 round of skeet, fell apart
Get you a period replacement pad and enjoy

[Bill Murphy]

Your pad is nailed on. I would leave it intact as long as it stays together.

[Paul Ehlers]

Bill nailed it!! Pun intended!

If this were my gun, I'd leave that pad alone and enjoy the gun just the way it is. The Galazan re-pop pads look the part, but you might as well be putting a red brick on your gun. They are recoil pads in name only and hard as a brick.

[Chuck Bishop]

If the pad can be saved, save it since it's original equipment. If it can't be saved, you have to decide if you want it original even though it will deteriorate quickly with heavy use or just have a Kick Ezz pad put on. A Kick Ezz pad is much more comfortable with heavy shooting. If the Jostam's pad can be saved, it can always be put back on if selling.

[Ed Hardy]

Bill nailed it!! Pun intended!

If this were my gun, I'd leave that pad alone and enjoy the gun just the way it is. The Galazan re-pop pads look the part, but you might as well be putting a red brick on your gun. They are recoil pads in name only and hard as a brick.

Nailed on!!! I hadn't thought of that!! I have not looked in the pad holes to see what is there. The pad is still soft so can be used; I had thought that if I replaced the pad I would keep the original (or original-ish) one with the gun. I had to replace the pad on my Three Barrel because in shape and consistency it resembled a ginormous piece of well used chewing gum, and have to agree that the replacement Galazan does feel pretty much like an orange extension of the wood stock......

Thanks for the advice. Key for these guns seems to be making sure they are in a case and not stored butt down in a safe.

Ed

[Mike Koneski]

Ed, store them barrel down in the safe.

[Chuck Bishop]

Tell Galazan, Barnett, Hadfield and other high grade gun dealers that they are storing their guns the wrong way. I don't doubt that in the old days they would over oil their guns to keep them working and keep them from rusting. That oil has long ago dried up. As the saying goes, "a little dab will do ya"!

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/p/AF1QipOGkeC8wonB-w5JqjwchYwEQDCNMIRMFG_EpYY2=s680-w680-h510-rw

[Bill Murphy]

The pad on your gun cannot be put back on if you take it off.

[Phillip Carr]

I have several of these pads that are new and original. If it letters with this pad I would have a new old stock professionally reinstalled.

[Chris Travinski]

Ed,
I have an NOS Jostam pad of that style if you're interested.

[Jerry Harlow]

Your pad is nailed on. I would leave it intact as long as it stays together.

Bill,
If it is nailed on as the originals were to be installed, wouldn't there be no holes in the back of the pad? I am betting that if a screwdriver of the proper size is sent down into the two holes, one will find screws holding it on. I could be wrong, but cannot find any other reason for the two holes in the original pad.

[Ed Hardy]

The pad on your gun cannot be put back on if you take it off.

Seems like a VERY strong reason to leave it the hell alone then......

Ed

[Dean Romig]

I think you could make it look pretty nice, if you want to get rid of that nice patina, with some judicious sanding on the sides of the pad with some very fine flint or garnet sandpaper… but leave the face of the pad as it is.

But first put some protective tape over the wood.



.

[Paul Ehlers]

Bill,
If it is nailed on as the originals were to be installed, wouldn't there be no holes in the back of the pad? I am betting that if a screwdriver of the proper size is sent down into the two holes, one will find screws holding it on. I could be wrong, but cannot find any other reason for the two holes in the original pad.

Bill is correct--These type pads are tacked & glued on. Click on the picture of the pad that researcher posted about them. The information in the text talks about the glueing & tacking method for installation.

I remember seeing some threads about these before, where the sponge rubber had to be cut through to remove the pad part just to reveal the tacks so the rest of the pad could be removed. I suspect that the holes in this pad were put there somewhere during this gun's life after the fact or whoever installed it decided two screws were an easier way to install it.

If only these guns could talk & tell us their story!

[Ed Hardy]

I have several of these pads that are new and original. If it letters with this pad I would have a new old stock professionally reinstalled.

I did request a research letter which is en route, but it might be one with no records. We shall see. I did see some used Jostams of this type on Ebay but they looked as used as this one. I think I will just take the sage advice of the people who were good enough to reply to my query and leave it as is. It has certainly been my MO with my military rifles and handguns--some people can't resist refinishing and generally messing with patina when really as long as something isn't actually broken, it shouldn't be touched.

Ed

[Ed Hardy]

Bill is correct--These type pads are tacked & glued on. Click on the picture of the pad that researcher posted about them. The information in the text talks about the glueing & tacking method for installation.

I remember seeing some threads about these before, where the sponge rubber had to be cut through to remove the pad part just to reveal the tacks so the rest of the pad could be removed. I suspect that the holes in this pad were put there somewhere during this gun's life after the fact or whoever installed it decided two screws were an easier way to install it.

If only these guns could talk & tell us their story!

They would have tales to tell for sure. Although some, like the gorgeous AYA SxS I got for next to nothing because someone had painted it with alternating green and black for "camo effect", might be too traumatized to actually talk. :rotf: The firearms equivalent of PTSD; maybe PBSD with B for Bubba.

Ed

[Mike Koneski]

Tell Galazan, Barnett, Hadfield and other high grade gun dealers that they are storing their guns the wrong way. I don't doubt that in the old days they would over oil their guns to keep them working and keep them from rusting. That oil has long ago dried up. As the saying goes, "a little dab will do ya"!

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/p/AF1QipOGkeC8wonB-w5JqjwchYwEQDCNMIRMFG_EpYY2=s680-w680-h510-rw

Simple solution to his problem is to store it barrel down. Those high end dealers don’t keep those guns on the butts 24/7/365 for years at a time. I’d be willing to wager that the guns in that pic do not all have original pads on them either. The old pads break down more than new/repro pads.

[Ed Hardy]

Simple solution to his problem is to store it barrel down. Those high end dealers don’t keep those guns on the butts 24/7/365 for years at a time. I’d be willing to wager that the guns in that pic do not all have original pads on them either. The old pads break down more than new/repro pads.

I have modified my gun safes to hold more guns, but also have laid down soft foam and then carpet on the bottom so the base has more "give". I think it is likely a combination of oil and storage maybe butt down on hard surfaces plus just age that does these old pads in. Storing barrel down makes sense though!

Ed

[Stan Hoover]

Ed,

I like these layered pads and would let it on if it is in decent condition. I know a new pad would be softer, but then again putting Magnum loads through these aging treasures is maybe not advisable.

I purchased a Fox with this style pad and it is as hard as a rock, but I really don’t know that I can remove it unless I find an original.

[Dave Noreen]

I just realized the face of the recoil pad on the OPs gun is the face of a JOSTAM Anti-Flinch, not the face that is normally on the Sponge Rubber pad.

138484

[Bill Murphy]

Learn something new every day.

[Jerry Harlow]

I just realized the face of the recoil pad on the OPs gun is the face of a JOSTAM Anti-Flinch, not the face that is normally on the Sponge Rubber pad.

138484

As I wrote previously in this thread, there is no reason for two screw holes in a nail and glue on pad. I am still betting there are two screws down those holes.

[Will Gurton]

As mentioned in multiple post the base Red Rubber plate is braded to the stock with multiple brads along the perimeter of the base plate.

So as to return this gun to as close to the factory treatment as possible I removed the outer portion of the pad which is nothing more than rubber cemented to the base plate and it came off surprisingly clean.

The trick is finding a competent smith to take the Sponge section of a NOS pad and grinding it to match.

Luckily I have such a craftsmen that I have kept busy for many years.

This is what can be done.

Good Luck, Will

[Ed Hardy]

As I wrote previously in this thread, there is no reason for two screw holes in a nail and glue on pad. I am still betting there are two screws down those holes.

I poked a thin blade screwdriver down into one of those holes, releasing a cloud of rotten rubber dust, and indeed there were two screws. Then entire pad did come off, and is super hard in places. I will see if someone has an NOS they would be willing to part with, because looking at that pad I am not sure it would stand up to more than a couple rounds of trap and that would be a shame. The gun itself is just BEGGING to be shot.

I am a little puzzled by the recoil pad since as Researcher noted in a previous reply, the lettering has the Jostam in a triangle and says "NO FLINCH", but the no flinch pads I see on the various internet sites were more of a solid rubber, like the Hy Gun, while the sponge rubber ones seem to have been called the "no kick coming". But, given the relative inexpensiveness of these pads and the fact they were made 100 years ago, I suppose they had different branding over the years. It would be nice to find a sponge one in good shape, but the odd thing about those (as previous replies have stated) is that they came in a box with little tacks like shoe nails and were nailed on and then the next layers glued on. There is no evidence at all this butt has had any nails in it, so maybe someone just drilled holes in a sponge pad and used screws......certainly the screw holes do not seem to be in the position I would usually expect pad screws to be placed.

Ed

[Ed Hardy]

I have several of these pads that are new and original. If it letters with this pad I would have a new old stock professionally reinstalled.

Unfortunately no records exist for this gun's serial number, so no way of knowing what it left the factory wearing. SN 206248 puts it as about a 1923 manufacture so the Jostam on it could easily be original.

Ed

[Phillip Carr]

PM sent.

[Tom Kidd]

I have modified my gun safes to hold more guns, but also have laid down soft foam and then carpet on the bottom so the base has more "give". I think it is likely a combination of oil and storage maybe butt down on hard surfaces plus just age that does these old pads in. Storing barrel down makes sense though!

Ed

Ed,

I like these layered pads and would let it on if it is in decent condition. I know a new pad would be softer, but then again putting Magnum loads through these aging treasures is maybe not advisable.

I purchased a Fox with this style pad and it is as hard as a rock, but I really don’t know that I can remove it unless I find an original.


Good Morning Stan,

I have a box or two of original soft sponges that were supplied to glue on. I should be out your way for my invite to hunt put and take pheasants at Central Penn in a few weeks. It will be a Saturday, and I will keep you posted when I find out which one. I use the long field towards the West with my track wheelchair. Keep in touch and Happy New Year, Tom

[Stan Hoover]

Good Morning Stan,

I have a box or two of original soft sponges that were supplied to glue on. I should be out your way for my invite to hunt put and take pheasants at Central Penn in a few weeks. It will be a Saturday, and I will keep you posted when I find out which one. I use the long field towards the West with my track wheelchair. Keep in touch and Happy New Year, Tom

Thanks Tom,

I really appreciate your kind gesture, I would love to meet you guys.

Look forward to hearing from you!!

Stan Hoover

[Dave Noreen]

The later JOSTAM Sponge Rubber Pads show the original S.A. Huntley patent date of Apr. 10, 1917, Patent No. 1,222,291 --

138670

actually granted after the Sponge Rubber pad was offered in the 1916 dated JOSTAM flyer I posted above which mentions a leather face.

138671

The May 12, 1931, patent date shown on the late JOSTAM Sponge Rubber Pads, Patent No. 1,805,273, shows a base screwed onto the gun stock and other improvements to adjust the pad's resilience. Were any of those "improvements" actually included in the later pads?

138668

138669

[Will Gurton]

Dave,

The original pad I removed from the 1923 gun only had the 1917 Pat date.

I could not find a like replacement and moved forward with the project with the 1931 Pat info also.

There were no adaptations like those depicted in the Patent information for screws, screw holes, or hollowed out plug sections.

Only an original Red Rubber base sheet, a kraft gum sealed packet of brads, and the Rubber and Sponge Assembly that is shown.

Will

[Stan Hillis]

While I totally understand the desire to replace an old unusable pad with one exactly like the original, we should remember that if the original consignee had needed to do so he likely would have ended up with one that had a later patent date as well, or possibly even a different style.

Your gun looks very nice, Will. Well done.